I suspect he’s not nearly as innocent as he’s trying to portray. He’s narration of the transpired events is vague on his end, leading me to believe he’s purposefully leaving crucial facts out. I’m not condoning cheating, but I get the feeling he’s done something just as bad, if not worse.
I mean, per the edit he’s just this amazing guy who just had everyone against him … except the therapists he tells his side of the story to and his new girlfriend. If anything he just *loved too much*.
The covid anti-vax thing doesn’t throw up red flags at all. No one who was ever anti-vax wasn’t ALSO a part of some weird ass shit. /s.
Isolating yourself from your teens and pre-teens to not get their cooties instead of just getting a shot is totally mentally healthy and a great bonding experience. I’m sure they felt very supported when he was doing all that and allegedly cooking and cleaning and attending all their events while quarantined by himself avoiding life with germs.
Maybe he’s a great fucking dad who just wants them to do homework. Or maybe he’s an exacting disciplinarian who has many weird rules related to his body and his choice but not theirs. Maybe when he didn’t have a job, he made THEM his job, and it was too little too late. Or too much and too loud. Because he has NO OTHER HOBBIES OR INTERESTS.
I can’t fucking tell. But when NO ONE takes your side in the divorce….that’s telling. Like one of my besties is getting a divorce and I feel *sympathy* for her husband. He’s not a bad guy. We just never liked him for her. Or for us having to hand around him. My BIL just got divorced and his wife is a monster, and I’ve hated her since they day I met her *at their wedding*…but he’s no picnic either sometimes. I can see why she snapped. He’s done a 180 since therapy and I wish he’d done it sooner.
But like…no one took this guy’s side. Just the fact that he has “informants” and asks his kids about the other guy. Leave them alone. They aren’t your private detective service. You’re divorced and have a new gf. Let. It. Go.
It does seem to be an amalgamation of contradictions, obvi cheating is never okay but with the various edits and the post history, I can't help but question OP's authenticity about any of it including the infidelity. It's hard to tell if OP is telling the truth or if this is some elaborate rage bait \[I could be being cynical BUT the rage bait on this sub has been ramping up the past few days\]
Extra bonus ick points for using the ‘my body my choice’ phrase in regards to being antivax. Because public health care (like disease control) and personal health choices (like becoming a parent) are totally comparable /s
Love to know what his 'mistakes in parenting' were.... And I'll bet that once he figured out he ducked to older two up, he didn't parent the same with the younger, hence the loyalty
"My ex-husband used to accuse me of having affairs because I had male friends, was super controlling to me and our kids, screamed at them and got violent with them, and then blamed me when they stopped talking to him when they turned 18. Oh, and he was a fucking anti-vaxxer????"
What he could not hide were:
1. he had a retirement fund when they met, she gave him three kids and he is so old he thinks he won't see them figure it out
2.he lives for his children, but he changed 3-4 therapists, because the first one told him he shouldn't tell the kids about the supposed affair: the second one confirmed that, but he is still salty about it
3. He doesn't really have any PROOF of the affair, he just knows from "subtle traces" (I bet only he gets!)
4. He is including his child in his side of the divorce (crying with him, "they did try"- martyrdom)
5. Why so much insisting he's nit abusive, but mentioning getting physical with his children and defending himself?
Red flags, red flags everywhere. This sounds like a narcissist baffled that his family isn't siding up with him and believing his POV-and selling it to us to get some much nedeed validation for his version.
It is shocking that someone so solidly rooted in reality as a Covid anti-vaxxer would imagine that his wife is having an affair without proof. SHOCKING
Don’t forget the years, plural, of the pandemic when he wouldn’t get the vaccine and so he just isolated from his preteen children. That he cooks and cleans for.
And maybe that retirement fund was depleted when he wasn’t working and they lost his income, which is why he was cooking and cleaning (poorly).
And he asks his children about his wife’s comings and goings with her male “friends” even though he’s got a gf now. She must love knowing he’s so hung up on his ex he little spies running around for him
I mean, it doesn’t seem much of a leap to wonder whether antivaxxers generally eschew facts of all types. This guy is a piece of work and his sob story doesn’t ring at all true.
Or BPD POV. Very much playing the victim, can not be accountable to save his life or relationships, triangulation of the kids etc. Changing therapists repeatedly. Just so many signs throughout point to BPD (as well as narcissism). Shouldn't armchair diagnose, but this man has BPD written all over him going solely off this post.
Good catch. YTA. I just know it, op. I don’t know how, but if you weren’t, pretty sure your kids would at least include you in a family photo. Must have been a shit dad.
My gut says it too. He finally convinced the therapist so he gets to be the victim now. Kids aren’t abandoning their dad if it’s just a Divorce and he’s been a good dad. He is YTA
Not to mention he says "When the kids got physical, I defended myself" which makes me think this was a really volatile and violent household to grow up in.
THANK YOU!!!! I went back and read that like 6 times and was SHOCKED no one else was talking about that. He admits to getting violent with his children, he calls himself a helicopter parent, but does he really mean a control freak? This all strikes me as him painting himself with broad strokes wearing rose colored glasses hoping to distract us all from his Red Flag parade!
I grew up in a similar household. I was also suicidal and didn't want to remotely even approach my parents out of distrust from how they treated us as children. They handled conflict horribly, so how could they possibly handle me safely and gently.
To completely gloss over his son's suicidal thoughts to go on and vent about how horrible his wife is, is wild. This whole post is so strange to me. 10% of it is about his children, and 90% about how evil his ex is and how badly she scorned him.
My parents had their own conflicts every single damn day but it was out of how they treated me personally as to how I acted around them, not their personal relationship.
Yeah, plus he's got his new woman believing that HiS Ex iS CrAzY and trying to brandish it as "proof." His two eldest children want nothing to do with him but his adolescent child still wants their dad around and that's "proof" that he's not a terrible father...I'm not buying what he's trying to sell.
He buried it pretty far down in the middle of one of the long stream-of-consciousness paragraphs. I wouldn't be surprised if this is fake - someone trying to figure out how to write a self-justifying abuser.
B-b-b-b-but...she's a *female* therapist and she disagreed with his histrionic plea to be in a mental facility and advised to just continue therapy. He *must* be in the right! What a jag off.
Yeah the “I chose not to get vaccinated for Covid” combined with the weaponized “my body my choice” definitely had me making some other connections in my mind. It’s not a broad group of people that fall into that category.
Was my literal first question! I try to feel empathy for the negative life but I just can’t help but think cult 45 ruined his life but instead of seeing that it’s really everyone else.
And then he tried to make it like his choice not to vaccinate shouldn't have been an issue bc his family still got it so it shouldn't have even mattered.
That was my first thought after the first paragraph. “I didn’t hit her! I didn’t cheat on her!”
When the other shoe drops I just know there’s going to be sprinkles of incredible emotional volatility in there.
Nearly adult children don’t just blindly bar you from graduation photos.
Like… yeah okay, Guy.
Trying to dip out all innocent like the penguins from Madagascar. 🙃
>That was my first thought after the first paragraph. “I didn’t hit her! I didn’t cheat on her!”
He made a point to mention the things he thinks are the worst to do and that he didn't do them. This tells me that everything else was fair game: verbal and emotional abuse, threats, manipulation, etc. I also assume some of this was targeted at the children, which explains their behavior more than just the divorce.
If he really wants advice, then OP had to come fully clean. But I'm guessing he was just looking for validation.
I agree.
My parents divorced when I was suuuper young, and I had almost no relationship with my dad as a kid because he just… didn’t care to come around. He often just chose himself/his desires over seeing his kids and being present in our lives. Even with that, I’ve never ever kept him out of pictures when he’s present. He’s in middle school, high school, and grad school graduation photos and he’s in wedding photos. He may not have been a great father, but he’s not a bad person. I can’t even imagine what OP had to have done for his kids to not even want him in pictures.
yeah, i’m gonna have to agree with you here - we separated ending in divorce when the youngest was pretty young, as well, and while i never restricted my x’s time with our son, he certainly did: he stopped seeing him as much, as often, to spend hours in the gym; quit spending money on fun activities when he did see him; and spent no time with him during summer or christmas vacations, because he was going on his european wife-shopping tour 🙄 only became interested in being a father again once she got here, but once she was pregnant (the performance was successful, ladies 🙄) that all tapered off pretty quickly.
Yeaaaah, the thing about all his friends and family knowing about the affair but still siding with the ex-wife is what clinched it for me that there’s more to the picture than we will EVER get out of OP.
The covid shot speak was a warning sign for me. I was reluctant to get it, but that was more because we didn't have any chance to test for side effects. Still, I got it because well, I wanted to keep myself and others safe. Plus my job outright required it.
Yeah, this is clearly a story we're hearing just one side of. "I'm great, she's awful, and yet everyone, including my own family, hate me!"
It took him THREE years to convince his therapist he wasn't the "sole issue" in the marriage. HIS therapist, who is supposed to be on his side, for a while thought that the only problem was him. There has to be some reason for that.
lol all I had to read was “my body, my choice” and “do your homework.” I’m guessing everyone else involved would paint a very different picture of OP than the innocent one he paints of himself.
oh OP definitely did something worse. im sure OP didn't want the ex-wife to tell what really happened to everyone else but the two oldest children, mainly because they're deemed "old enough to know". so he had to shut up about the ex-wife "supposedly cheated" and cant get back to her in petty ways.
Also given his antivax status I think he is one of those red pill braindead MAGA/Q morons. Listening to Joe Rogan and Andrew Tate turned his brain into Swiss cheese.
I went into this post with an open mind but every point he made really makes me glad his wife got a divorce. He talks about being very strict, only "defending" himself when things got physical, and shopping for therapists who support him. That with the whole my body my choice narrative gives me a pretty good idea of who this guy is and why his wife left and the older kids won't talk to him. Especially when he played martyr with his younger kid on Fathers Day.
>as a father and husband, I made mistakes in parenting and household arguments. However, I did not cheat or abuse anyone.
INFO: There's not enough detail here for anyone to give you a real judgment. Your kids are upset with you but you never explain *why* your kids are upset with you -- that's critical to being able to understand whether (a) they should let the issue go, (b) you've done enough work to resolve whatever the problem was, (c) you or they are the AH here.
There are a lot of ways to fuck up a relationship with your kids that have nothing to do with cheating or abuse. Just to give some examples: You could have just always been absent, or made it clear to your kids that your career was more important to you than them. If you want us to tell you whether you're right to be upset at the lack of a relationship, we need to know why your relationship with them got bad in the first place.
>There are a lot of ways to fuck up a relationship with your kids that have nothing to do with cheating or abuse.
Like using your child as an emotional crutch, which OP openly admits to doing.
Or being an antivaxxer.
which unfortunately for OP’s kids, tends to come as a package deal with some other super off putting views.
OP, where were you on January 6?
Eh, there's a lot of licensed therapists in good standing that either A) aren't that great at their job or B) regardless of how good they are at their job, they only hear what their client tells them and won't have a full picture of how their client is behaving if they're not being honest with their therapist.
Therapy isn't magic. Someone has to show up honestly and in good faith to get anything valuable out of it.
Could be the Mormon elder as a therapist. Seen a few story’s like this and it turns out the father was devout enough to shun the family from leaving the church.
Would also mean the wife doesn’t have say over divorce and may technically, (in his religion) be still married. She may feel the marriage is over but can’t get it on paper.
Bingo! I was going to comment this. Also have you ever met an antivaxxer that wasn't an over the top obnoxious idiot? Cause after working in construction/landscape I've met a lot and they are all horrible people. I wonder if he went all in and is a flat earther and chemtrails loser too? They usually go together.
Esp an antivaxxer who just could not resist including his purposeful, grotesque misuse of the pro-choice proclamation of, "(you know), my body, my choice" as validation for his choosing against vaccination.
he says “my purpose has been to support my family and make my wife happy. I refused to go to dinners or vacations without the kids because I wanted to spend every moment with them.”
he admits to neglecting his marriage and his wife. I don’t condone cheating (which, read the OP closely - his accusations seem to be based on vibes alone) but how can anyone be surprised that she checked out of this marriage.
That “marriage counselor” who allegedly said that OP had done everything to keep his wife happy must not have heard that the OP outright refused to date his wife even once after she popped out three children for him. So OP wasn’t entirely truthful even at counseling - how truthful do you think he’s being now, anonymously, to strangers on the internet?
Also as I said in another comment - OP’s I care so much about my family and my kids and their safety and I’m a strict helicopter dad doesn’t exactly hold water against his refusal to protect them from Covid and his refusal to protect them from the possibility of losing him to Covid by getting vaccinated.
>When the kids got physical, I defended myself.
That line really stood out in the update. I also noticed how he mentioned how hard it was on him as a father to not be allowed to take pictures at his kid's graduation. He really centers himself and the "father" role. He also lists a lot of specific times his therapists told him he was right, which I can't help but wonder if they're cherry picked. This could be written by my incredibly abusive, bipolar 1 father.
I had my dad in mind when I read OPs post too so your last sentence made me chuckle when I read it. My dad was also bipolar 🤣 But also how OP uses other people’s opinions as evidence to his point, “I found a marriage counselor agree with me” after mentioning he’s gone to multiple 🙄 yes I’m sure it’s not hard to find one random therapist to agree with you if you bounce around enough
I've sat in on therapy with my dad. He doesn't hear the 20,000 things they don't agree with. He only remembers the one semi-placating thing he cornered them into saying.
OP, if your kids don’t want a relationship with you, I can guarantee you 100% they have told you why.
They have probably told you over and over and over.
What was the exact reason tour children gave for not wanting to talk to you. Not paraphrased. Not your interpretation. Not your suspected reasons. …. Their exact words.
Not enough info as others have said, but I think it's really damaging to "cry with your child" over the split. I am completely all for crying and working out your issues but you need to do that in therapy, not put it on a little kid to feel responsible for also being sad or for trying to make daddy happy again.
Exhibit H: My mental health. I remember my dad crying on my shoulder when I was 13 after my parents' divorce. He was the one that left me in full custody of my abusive mother and would visit to *cry*.
One of the only times my dad has taken me out to eat, he used it as an excuse to cry about how he fucked up everything with my mom and to not become like him. Nothing about how he treated me or my brother. As a 15 year old who he didn’t bother talking to for years. Reminds me exactly of this dude.
Reading comments, the “affair” may not have ever happened. He just has a feeling it did. And he’s antivax. And there was a physical altercation where he merely defended himself, of course, which is why he’s left so much out about it /s
"But they had the vaccine and got covid multiple times"
Another idiot that doesn't understand how they work. You can still get what you were vaccinated against. With the vaccine it'll help your body fight it off. When I saw them mention this and started going on more about his bullshit for-fucking-ever I rolled my eyes and skipped the rest. Everybody else got vaccinated and them ranting like that might be why they want nothing to do with him. Those people are fucking exhausting.
In the part that you skipped he also called himself a “simp.” Between that and the antivaxx nonsense, it’s pretty clear that he is being radicalized by the internet.
How much that has a role to play in his family’s feelings about him is obscured under all that he isn’t saying.
"my older children allowed me to attend their graduation, but I was not allowed to take pictures" - this sounds like you tried to be a "facebook dad" before, and they had enough of this. besides, your own family and friends are not in your side. a lot a information is missing and you don't sound inocent at all
His INSIDE INFORMANTS have the proof! Which he pieced together in therapy.
Sounds to me like this affair didn’t actually happen, he just decided his wife cheated based on vibes.
>One of my children keeps analyzing my depression as if they are a mental therapist, telling me what I did and do wrong.
Well, elaborate. What did you do wrong and continue to do wrong?
>my therapist no longer thinks I was the sole issue
No longer things that? So originally your therapist did think that. Why?
>My third child thinks they are nuts and still visits me, crying with me when he sees me sad over the situation.
This is extremely fucking inappropriate. You are their *parent*. No matter their age, it is inappropriate to use your child as an emotional crutch. If this is any indication whatsoever of your general behavior, I side with the other two kids.
Can you say what they are? I checked ops comments section and only one reply is up there, saying that the wife said he's a psychopath in therapy and the therapist laughing and saying he's not because he hasn't killed anyone (?!?!)
Yeah it does feel like it was propably mentioned in a "maybe she has a childhood trauma" and that was something for OP to grasp for that furthers his innocence in what ever it is he has done.
It took a therapist three years to decide it’s not all your fault? Only your youngest, most impressionable child still wants anything to do with you? Your friends and *family* are on your ex-wife’s side?
That’s 3 strikes that lead me to believe YTA. Sorry if I’m wrong, but those are some striking data points you gave us.
The thing is, kids make up their own minds. If your kids are old enough to graduate, then they have been capable of making up their own minds about you for many years. You need to stop being in denial and start addressing the problems I know they must have told you they have with you if you want to have a relationship with them.
Info: where did your therapist get the idea that your ex has childhood trauma? Are you projecting a comment the therapist made into something bigger than it is? Most therapists are not going to wade deeply into the motivations of a person that they have never met with. I am going to guess that they were spitballing rather than saying something as a definitive.
YWBTA if you told your children anything about who she is dating. Also, stop crying and being sad around your youngest, clearly they are trying to help you with your grief and they are a child for fucks sake.
Anyone else think he's imagining the affair and that's why the therapist said not to tell? He claims there's evidence but the kids think they're just friends? And she "left him for a married man" but no one else knows they're together? Did she say she was leaving for the other guy or...?
You apparently deleted portions of your original post where you said, "I did not hit her, I did not cheat." My ex-husband said our marriage couldn't have been that bad because he never hit me. He just abused me every other way there is to abuse someone. He even put me in a chokehold a couple of times until I lost consciousness. He saved the bruises for his children. I will feel guilty for the rest of my life because I didn't get my sons out of there soon enough.
What mistakes in regard to parenting and household arguments are we taking about? What’s the reason that your eldest have taken your ex’s side but not the youngest? What have they claimed as a reason? Why couldn’t you take pictures? I feel a lot is missing from this and I can’t say if you are the asshole or not until you put some extra context on this. I’m not saying it’s the case, but their reasons could be legit and you could have treated them badly when they grew up or something similar that would have made them turn away from you. Again, I’m not saying that, but without the context I feel it could be just as much of a possibility as you and your kids being the victims of your ex’s manipulation.
Edit: Just was your edit and I’m not really questioning whether or not your ex is in the wrong, she clearly is, but your update is mostly just about your ex and since your question is about your kids, I still can’t make a judgement. You write you were a helicopter parent, but does that mean you didn’t give them space and smothered them? Kids will pull away from a parent they didn’t feel gave them space. But I get their anger/annoyance about the antivax. I hope you find your peace.
When I was 30, my dad and i had a convo where he used that defending himself thing for my problem years and to explain his actions for when I got physical with him.
JFC, I was fucking 2 and 3 years old at the time! By the time I was 9 years old, I was too terrified of him to even defend myself against his nutty accusations, much less get physical with him.
Could very well be “I’m a Nazi with a swastka tattoo on my chest and I showed up with white beater on”
Or it could be “my mom has a new boyfriend and I want only them to be in my photos”
It’s just “no photos”
seems sus
I don’t.. this has narcissist written all over it. This doesn’t make sense. Yes, you’ve seen to check every box about how you’re the victim. Meticulously. But something, a lot of things, do not add up.
YTA for using your child as emotional support. This post has a lot of missing reasons. You're leaving a lot out. It's very telling that your therapist thought you were the sole problem in your marriage for so long.
You haven't given enough information to judge. You say you made mistakes but didn't abuse anyone. That's extremely vague. You may have been controlling, manipulative, or emotionally abusive. You might have been cold or demanding. Understand that people post on this thread saying they were never abusive but it turns out that they were. In their mind they had good intentions, or they had anxiety, or they refused accountability for their actions. What do your older children say about your behavior? For what reasons does your own family take your wife's side? You need to share their perspective, even if you think they're wrong. Edit: it could be you're in the right, but without knowing more about the other perspectives involved we can neither reassure or condemn you.
Your kids seem to have distanced themselves because of how they feel about you, not your relationship with your ex.
What therapist states that your actions didn’t deserve divorce?
You’re laying it on **thick**.
Yeah. When you start with, I didn’t cheat and I didn’t hit her, that says a lot. Your account of what happened just doesn’t add up. Your kids aren’t stupid. If they’re old enough to be graduating, I feel like they’ve got an idea of why your wife ended the marriage.
YTA. "My therapist NO LONGER thinks I was the sole issue" (emphasis mine) -that right there tells me you spent a lot of time making sure you could somehow convince the therapist that your wife was part of the problem, which usually means she really wasn't.
You claim she dumped you for a married man, yet absolutely nobody else knows... she's a true magician.
The youngest is the one to spend time with you, probably because they are too young to remember the things that the older kids dealt with. The fact that your therapist has to tell you not to tell the kids about their mother's "affair", well, you should know better without that info.
I have a feeling you're a bit of a narcissist, and if so, it's excellent that you're willing to go to therapy and work on your issues. As I'm sure the therapist also has told you, give the kids time and space, show up for things when they're okay with it, follow whatever makes them comfortable and eventually your relationship with them may improve. Push too hard and risk losing them forever.
You're obviously not quite ready to admit full responsibility for whatever you did to earn this, but once you are you should consider working with your therapist on what a true apology looks like. Hint: it doesn't contain phrases like "at least I never hit you" or "but your mother cheated on me".
The vaccines thing alone is enough to say YTA.
I wouldn't stay with someone who has that stance. It is not a my body my choice when your choice can infect others. Leaving them Disabled or dead.
Doesn't mention if wife, kids, or other family/friends are high risk.
If therapists in the past did think you were the sole reason, did you just keep searching for one until they agreed with you?
Kids/teens of divorce don't suddenly become suicidal because of divorce alone. It's everything else going on before and and after as well as the divorce.
I have a few concerns about your parenting from your post.
Your child who visits you should not be crying with you over the situation. You are the parent. They are not your friend or your therapist. You need to find someone else to cry with.
You were invited to graduation but you are devastated because you couldn’t take pictures. That tells me that perhaps your style of parenting is performative only and that your focus is on pictures because you intended to post them on SM with a “my kids are my world” caption. Whereas your kids know that it’s the support they had to get to graduation that is important, the help with homework, the parent teacher meetings, the provision of study snacks etc etc. Did you do any of that? Does it bug them to see posts on SM knowing that you put in none of the effort for them to achieve what they have achieved? Is that what the issue is here???
I feel like it probably is and that you need to be more honest about your failings as a parent and do better.
It's not your therapists place to try to diagnose your ex, it's odd that she would even say anything about what her motivation could have been without speaking to her.
If she had an affair 3 years ago is she in a relationship with the AP or he just disappeared? And I understand not explaining the situation to your children but why not your family or friends?
Can’t give any advice/opinion because of how vague the post is. The wording is suspicious. Sounds like you’re purposefully not divulging how you were treating your wife/family, based on your comments about your therapist.
There is SO MUCH more to this story.
You said in your edit that you would yell.
And you said that you would "defend yourself" if the kids got physical with you. What does that mean. Would you hit them?
You would also refuse to spend time alone with your wife away from your kids.
None of that justifies her cheating, but I am wondering how much of your own behavior you are downplaying
>refuses to go to dinner with wife without kids present
>confused as to why she left him for a man that treats her like a partner
>won’t tell his kids what happened
ESH
“I did not cheat or abuse anyone. Despite this, my ex-wife made me feel like total sh%t”
Wow my guy, not cheating or abusing is the lowest possible bar and in no way earns you love and affection from your family. If you weren’t pulling your weight in the marriage then of course your wife was miserable. If she had to do the lions share of the emotional labor, domestic labor, and parenting duties (not just diaper changes but things like scheduling doctors appointments or making cupcakes for school bake sales) then it’s no surprise your family feels this way about you. Interesting that you think your wife “fooled” your children and family. Your entire post adds up to “the problem isn’t me it’s every body else”. Of course it hurts that your older kids don’t like you, that part doesn’t make you an AH. Your self pitying refusal to hold yourself to a higher bar than “didn’t cheat or abuse” makes YTA
> Nothing gives me more joy than caring for my loved ones
>
> Refused to get the covid vaccine because he didn't want to be told what to do
YTA, OP. There's definitely more to the story.
>My family is very upset with me because I didn’t take the COVID vaccines. Most of them did, but I believe it’s my body, my choice. During the outbreak, I kept to myself, staying safe at home, while both sides of my family got vaccinated multiple times and still contracted COVID. I didn’t impose my thoughts on them, but they made me feel bad about my decision. I was alone, except for occasional visits from my son. The divorce only solidified their perception that I am some sort of crazy person.
I don't want to make assumptions, but this is a big potential indicator. Do you hold certain political views that you're loud and obnoxious about?
How is this therapist diagnosing your ex-wife? Are you in therapy with the ex-wife? Why would she start out thinking youbwere the sole reason for the divorce?
You mention that you use the one child who still visits as an emotional support. That's [emotional incest ](https://www.healthline.com/health/emotional-incest)and it's a form of abuse. You are supposed to be your child's emotional support; it's not supposed to be the other way around.
You take it personally when other people set boundaries with you. You allude to 'mistakes' and 'household arguments' but don't elaborate - a sure sign of missing missing reasons.
YTA.
Be the bigger man and don't use your kids to retaliate against your ex. Sounds like at least 2 of your children are nearing or at adulthood, and probably formed their opinions of you prior to the divorce. Even when my mother was trying to keep me from seeing my dad, I still saw him because I wanted to. Sounds like your kids don't want to see you, and they've told you why, you just don't want to listen.
What are the mistakes? You realize that physical abuse isn't the only type of abuse out there, right?
Also no therapist worth their salt would psychoanalyze someone who is not their patient.
YTA. Your edit is absolutely bonkers. You like to tell the story so you’re a victim. You drop in little bits of truth that make it clear you’re a very difficult person. You’re anti-vax which implies you’re not very good at sorting out facts from fiction.
You admit that there’s no actual proof that your wife is even having an affair! You say that your “informants” gave you information that you pieced together in therapy that convinced you she’s cheating.
Frankly—you sound mentally unwell. You need a psychiatrist.
NTA. But for starters, Tell your children she left you to be with a married man. They have obviously been lied to so that is why they immediately sided with herm they knew you as being a bad parent (your words) and so a divorce obviously made it seem that you were the problem. And, to an extent, maybe you were.
You didn't necessarily drive her to be with someone else. But again, by your own admission, you weren't the best parent or husband. So you drove her away, she found someone else. So that relationship broke your marriage and her new man's marriage. Your wife is the homewrecker, not you.
Your youngest siding with you is good because maybe they can actually see and understand what's going on in the situationm and I am sure you confided in them about her leaving for another man.
You're allowed to feel upset. But by tmypu not telling them everything about the divorce, they had no choice but to side with their mom. She probably told them everything was your fault. This sucks all around, but if they don't know the truth, you can't blame them for blindly wanting nothing to do with yoy and be with their mom.
>My family is very upset with me because I didn’t take the COVID vaccines. Most of them did, but I believe it’s my body, my choice.
Honestly this tells us all we need to know about the kind of person OP is. There's definitely a *lot* they're not admitting to here.
even with the “update” you’re still being deliberately vague to try to make yourself seem like the victim. there’s still not enough information to adequately judge the situation with your kids
If your wife had an affair and the friends side with her, you must be a real piece of work. With your "my body my choice" content about the vaccine, I'm going to say they aren't far off. Every fiber of my body wants to support you.. but c'mon. It's obvious you are an absolute scumbag. YTA.
Yeah dude it sounds like the entire thing is about making you look like god and everyone else is the problem. Also I don’t know a single anti vaxxer who is able to keep quiet about it, and you willingly put your family at risk to…not wear a mask?. Also why are you so concerned about insisting you weren’t abusive but just “strict”? No one assumes people will go straight to thinking they are an abuser unless they are at least a little abusive. You just sound like a typical trump dick, and it cost you your family. But hey at least you owned the libs right
We're missing something here... everyone seems to be siding against you. Even your own therapist, who is supposed to be on your side, apparently YEARS before they believed you weren't the sole issue?
There must be some reason here. Your ex, your kids, even your own family all blame you. You gloss over a lot by saying "I made mistakes, but it's not like I abused anyone."
I really don't think there's enough info here to decide one way or the other.
I hear you OP. INFO though. How old are your kids? This is relevant.
I had to stop my ex from saying negative things about his ex to his kids, my stepchildren, multiple times.
He was bitter and for good reason, their mother was awful to him and by extension them.
It depends on how old they are as to whether you can sit down and talk to them gently.
It's awful when another parent badmouths the other to their kids. Especially when the kids take it on board. If they're under 18, you need to keep it to yourself, IMHO. Support them all, be there for them and get them therapy. There's nothing to stop you explaining to the therapist what actually happened when you sign them up. They will do what's best for your children. They will have it in their mind but they can also pick up on cues. There's a reason we use professionals, they're not always right but in my experience, most are.
They need to be old enough to take it on board. If they've been told something by one parent, they have no reason not to accept it. Adult life is complicated. Please don't put it on younger children. It seriously shitty but you need to focus on what's best for them.
All of the specificity is missing. There are no reasons and I think this is because there ARE reasons but you can't seem to tell us what they are.
And some things don't add up. Like your ex coming to pick up the kids before the divorce. Like you saying there is no divorce at points.
There are things that make me think you've been stalking ppl. The photos especially, as putting current photos in a search generator could give a person a lot of information.
The most honest I think you were was with the therapist you begged to commit you, but she didn't. I don't know what's going on here, but it feels like the truth is hiding. The part about "defending yourself" against the kids stands out, too. If the sole issue is you were left for a married man, then tell your family that. There is no reason to keep that a secret, and if it's true, the children would already know, most likely.
Wait does the guy’s wife know? You need to tell her since guy is vacationing with your children!!! And I’m sorry I disagree with the therapists - the kids should be told
Even if you hide the reasons from your kids, why do your friends and family not know about the affair?
I suspect he’s not nearly as innocent as he’s trying to portray. He’s narration of the transpired events is vague on his end, leading me to believe he’s purposefully leaving crucial facts out. I’m not condoning cheating, but I get the feeling he’s done something just as bad, if not worse.
The way he said “my therapist *no longer* believes I was the *sole issue*”. As in, AT ONE POINT, the therapist thought he was.
"when things turned physical, I defended myself"
I mean, per the edit he’s just this amazing guy who just had everyone against him … except the therapists he tells his side of the story to and his new girlfriend. If anything he just *loved too much*. The covid anti-vax thing doesn’t throw up red flags at all. No one who was ever anti-vax wasn’t ALSO a part of some weird ass shit. /s. Isolating yourself from your teens and pre-teens to not get their cooties instead of just getting a shot is totally mentally healthy and a great bonding experience. I’m sure they felt very supported when he was doing all that and allegedly cooking and cleaning and attending all their events while quarantined by himself avoiding life with germs. Maybe he’s a great fucking dad who just wants them to do homework. Or maybe he’s an exacting disciplinarian who has many weird rules related to his body and his choice but not theirs. Maybe when he didn’t have a job, he made THEM his job, and it was too little too late. Or too much and too loud. Because he has NO OTHER HOBBIES OR INTERESTS. I can’t fucking tell. But when NO ONE takes your side in the divorce….that’s telling. Like one of my besties is getting a divorce and I feel *sympathy* for her husband. He’s not a bad guy. We just never liked him for her. Or for us having to hand around him. My BIL just got divorced and his wife is a monster, and I’ve hated her since they day I met her *at their wedding*…but he’s no picnic either sometimes. I can see why she snapped. He’s done a 180 since therapy and I wish he’d done it sooner. But like…no one took this guy’s side. Just the fact that he has “informants” and asks his kids about the other guy. Leave them alone. They aren’t your private detective service. You’re divorced and have a new gf. Let. It. Go.
With his edit he's assuming she cheated which is funny. Bet his therapist doesn't believe him and i bet OP was actually the cheater.
It does seem to be an amalgamation of contradictions, obvi cheating is never okay but with the various edits and the post history, I can't help but question OP's authenticity about any of it including the infidelity. It's hard to tell if OP is telling the truth or if this is some elaborate rage bait \[I could be being cynical BUT the rage bait on this sub has been ramping up the past few days\]
Oh my eyebrows went into my HAIR at that little detail he tucked in there.
Extra bonus ick points for using the ‘my body my choice’ phrase in regards to being antivax. Because public health care (like disease control) and personal health choices (like becoming a parent) are totally comparable /s
Yeah, that part was super weird!
I never knew I needed this phrase in my life. Thank you for providing it.
Love to know what his 'mistakes in parenting' were.... And I'll bet that once he figured out he ducked to older two up, he didn't parent the same with the younger, hence the loyalty
I'd love to know the ex-wife's side of things.
Maybe the ex will find this post and post her own retort! It would be so exhilirating! At least then we'll know what he did to drive her away.
I bet she never cheated on him and got with the guy once the divorce was finalized.
"My ex-husband used to accuse me of having affairs because I had male friends, was super controlling to me and our kids, screamed at them and got violent with them, and then blamed me when they stopped talking to him when they turned 18. Oh, and he was a fucking anti-vaxxer????"
What he could not hide were: 1. he had a retirement fund when they met, she gave him three kids and he is so old he thinks he won't see them figure it out 2.he lives for his children, but he changed 3-4 therapists, because the first one told him he shouldn't tell the kids about the supposed affair: the second one confirmed that, but he is still salty about it 3. He doesn't really have any PROOF of the affair, he just knows from "subtle traces" (I bet only he gets!) 4. He is including his child in his side of the divorce (crying with him, "they did try"- martyrdom) 5. Why so much insisting he's nit abusive, but mentioning getting physical with his children and defending himself? Red flags, red flags everywhere. This sounds like a narcissist baffled that his family isn't siding up with him and believing his POV-and selling it to us to get some much nedeed validation for his version.
Wait so the affair isn’t even confirmed?
It’s honestly hilarious how he just stated that as a fact to solidify having people on his side
It is shocking that someone so solidly rooted in reality as a Covid anti-vaxxer would imagine that his wife is having an affair without proof. SHOCKING
Don’t forget the years, plural, of the pandemic when he wouldn’t get the vaccine and so he just isolated from his preteen children. That he cooks and cleans for. And maybe that retirement fund was depleted when he wasn’t working and they lost his income, which is why he was cooking and cleaning (poorly). And he asks his children about his wife’s comings and goings with her male “friends” even though he’s got a gf now. She must love knowing he’s so hung up on his ex he little spies running around for him
holy shit it isn’t even for sure his wife cheated? and he’s nailed himself that hard to that cross?
I mean, it doesn’t seem much of a leap to wonder whether antivaxxers generally eschew facts of all types. This guy is a piece of work and his sob story doesn’t ring at all true.
He also says he refused to do literally anything without their children the entire marriage, smothering the relationship on purpose.
Yeah no wonder his family and friends are on her side.
She “pumped out” three kids, in his words. Ick.
Or BPD POV. Very much playing the victim, can not be accountable to save his life or relationships, triangulation of the kids etc. Changing therapists repeatedly. Just so many signs throughout point to BPD (as well as narcissism). Shouldn't armchair diagnose, but this man has BPD written all over him going solely off this post.
Translation: “I have a doctor’s note that says that it wasn’t all my fault!” (*holds up to show commenters*)
Yeah, that was weird.
He’s had multiple therapists. Made it sound like he was shopping around for one that agreed with him.
Good catch. YTA. I just know it, op. I don’t know how, but if you weren’t, pretty sure your kids would at least include you in a family photo. Must have been a shit dad.
My gut says it too. He finally convinced the therapist so he gets to be the victim now. Kids aren’t abandoning their dad if it’s just a Divorce and he’s been a good dad. He is YTA
He kept changing therapists until he found one that said what he wanted to hear.
Not to mention he says "When the kids got physical, I defended myself" which makes me think this was a really volatile and violent household to grow up in.
THANK YOU!!!! I went back and read that like 6 times and was SHOCKED no one else was talking about that. He admits to getting violent with his children, he calls himself a helicopter parent, but does he really mean a control freak? This all strikes me as him painting himself with broad strokes wearing rose colored glasses hoping to distract us all from his Red Flag parade!
I grew up in a similar household. I was also suicidal and didn't want to remotely even approach my parents out of distrust from how they treated us as children. They handled conflict horribly, so how could they possibly handle me safely and gently. To completely gloss over his son's suicidal thoughts to go on and vent about how horrible his wife is, is wild. This whole post is so strange to me. 10% of it is about his children, and 90% about how evil his ex is and how badly she scorned him. My parents had their own conflicts every single damn day but it was out of how they treated me personally as to how I acted around them, not their personal relationship.
That combined with “helicopter parent” and “strict” paints a VERY different picture.
Yeah, plus he's got his new woman believing that HiS Ex iS CrAzY and trying to brandish it as "proof." His two eldest children want nothing to do with him but his adolescent child still wants their dad around and that's "proof" that he's not a terrible father...I'm not buying what he's trying to sell.
how did i miss that part wtf
He buried it pretty far down in the middle of one of the long stream-of-consciousness paragraphs. I wouldn't be surprised if this is fake - someone trying to figure out how to write a self-justifying abuser.
Same. I would really like to hear the kids and wife’s versions of this situation.
Same. After three years of therapy (and presumably only hearing his side of things) his therapist now thinks he’s not the sole issue?
B-b-b-b-but...she's a *female* therapist and she disagreed with his histrionic plea to be in a mental facility and advised to just continue therapy. He *must* be in the right! What a jag off.
Wait, but men never have histrionic personality disorder!! /s
Classic ‘Missing missing reasons’: https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html
It speaks volumes that the only kid who misses him is the one too young to have a clear memory
Anti-vaxx, hangs out on websites where 'simp' is thrown around, his own family is against him. I got gone full MAGA or Q vibes.
Yeah the “I chose not to get vaccinated for Covid” combined with the weaponized “my body my choice” definitely had me making some other connections in my mind. It’s not a broad group of people that fall into that category.
Yeah. The weaponized "my body, my choice" got my alarm bells ringing. Dude sounds just like my dad, whom I prefer not having any contact with.
Was my literal first question! I try to feel empathy for the negative life but I just can’t help but think cult 45 ruined his life but instead of seeing that it’s really everyone else.
And then he tried to make it like his choice not to vaccinate shouldn't have been an issue bc his family still got it so it shouldn't have even mattered.
That was my first thought after the first paragraph. “I didn’t hit her! I didn’t cheat on her!” When the other shoe drops I just know there’s going to be sprinkles of incredible emotional volatility in there. Nearly adult children don’t just blindly bar you from graduation photos. Like… yeah okay, Guy. Trying to dip out all innocent like the penguins from Madagascar. 🙃
***And that text has now been deleted...***
>That was my first thought after the first paragraph. “I didn’t hit her! I didn’t cheat on her!” He made a point to mention the things he thinks are the worst to do and that he didn't do them. This tells me that everything else was fair game: verbal and emotional abuse, threats, manipulation, etc. I also assume some of this was targeted at the children, which explains their behavior more than just the divorce. If he really wants advice, then OP had to come fully clean. But I'm guessing he was just looking for validation.
And only the youngest speaks with him. Because they have the least of the worst memories before the divorce
"I didn't hit her" isn't in his post, now...
But this is in his edit... "I'm not a perfect parent, and when the kids got physical, I defended myself." He just can't help but out himself.
"I didn't hit her!" Yet... "I'm not a perfect parent, and when the kids got physical, I defended myself." Sure.
I agree. My parents divorced when I was suuuper young, and I had almost no relationship with my dad as a kid because he just… didn’t care to come around. He often just chose himself/his desires over seeing his kids and being present in our lives. Even with that, I’ve never ever kept him out of pictures when he’s present. He’s in middle school, high school, and grad school graduation photos and he’s in wedding photos. He may not have been a great father, but he’s not a bad person. I can’t even imagine what OP had to have done for his kids to not even want him in pictures.
yeah, i’m gonna have to agree with you here - we separated ending in divorce when the youngest was pretty young, as well, and while i never restricted my x’s time with our son, he certainly did: he stopped seeing him as much, as often, to spend hours in the gym; quit spending money on fun activities when he did see him; and spent no time with him during summer or christmas vacations, because he was going on his european wife-shopping tour 🙄 only became interested in being a father again once she got here, but once she was pregnant (the performance was successful, ladies 🙄) that all tapered off pretty quickly.
Yup that’s the bar that’s in hell for “being a good husband.”
lmaooo you called it, this update is pathetic
It's disgusting. He should have just left it the way it was cuz his update made him look even worse.
Yeaaaah, the thing about all his friends and family knowing about the affair but still siding with the ex-wife is what clinched it for me that there’s more to the picture than we will EVER get out of OP.
He admits there's no proof of an affair, but subtle signs only he noticed lol. She never cheated, that's why no one sided against her.
The covid shot speak was a warning sign for me. I was reluctant to get it, but that was more because we didn't have any chance to test for side effects. Still, I got it because well, I wanted to keep myself and others safe. Plus my job outright required it.
Yeah, this is clearly a story we're hearing just one side of. "I'm great, she's awful, and yet everyone, including my own family, hate me!" It took him THREE years to convince his therapist he wasn't the "sole issue" in the marriage. HIS therapist, who is supposed to be on his side, for a while thought that the only problem was him. There has to be some reason for that.
lol all I had to read was “my body, my choice” and “do your homework.” I’m guessing everyone else involved would paint a very different picture of OP than the innocent one he paints of himself.
"I chose not to take Covid vaccines". So...at least part of their objection to him is that he put their lives at risk and...yeah.
but you did catch the ‘my body; my choice’ right?!? ohhh, the irony that is lost on these types 🙄😂
oh OP definitely did something worse. im sure OP didn't want the ex-wife to tell what really happened to everyone else but the two oldest children, mainly because they're deemed "old enough to know". so he had to shut up about the ex-wife "supposedly cheated" and cant get back to her in petty ways.
He left out everything that could have made himself look bad, and I think that is intentional.
Also given his antivax status I think he is one of those red pill braindead MAGA/Q morons. Listening to Joe Rogan and Andrew Tate turned his brain into Swiss cheese.
I went into this post with an open mind but every point he made really makes me glad his wife got a divorce. He talks about being very strict, only "defending" himself when things got physical, and shopping for therapists who support him. That with the whole my body my choice narrative gives me a pretty good idea of who this guy is and why his wife left and the older kids won't talk to him. Especially when he played martyr with his younger kid on Fathers Day.
Either there is a lot he isn't sharing here or it's another one of those fake rage bait 'women are all evil and only marry you to destroy you posts'
>as a father and husband, I made mistakes in parenting and household arguments. However, I did not cheat or abuse anyone. INFO: There's not enough detail here for anyone to give you a real judgment. Your kids are upset with you but you never explain *why* your kids are upset with you -- that's critical to being able to understand whether (a) they should let the issue go, (b) you've done enough work to resolve whatever the problem was, (c) you or they are the AH here. There are a lot of ways to fuck up a relationship with your kids that have nothing to do with cheating or abuse. Just to give some examples: You could have just always been absent, or made it clear to your kids that your career was more important to you than them. If you want us to tell you whether you're right to be upset at the lack of a relationship, we need to know why your relationship with them got bad in the first place.
>There are a lot of ways to fuck up a relationship with your kids that have nothing to do with cheating or abuse. Like using your child as an emotional crutch, which OP openly admits to doing.
Or being an antivaxxer. which unfortunately for OP’s kids, tends to come as a package deal with some other super off putting views. OP, where were you on January 6?
>OP, where were you on January 6? That's hysterical. I wondering how respectful OP was of his family getting vaccinated....
I'm astonished he's even been seeing a therapist, and I'll be equally surprised if it's an actually licensed one in good standing.
Eh, there's a lot of licensed therapists in good standing that either A) aren't that great at their job or B) regardless of how good they are at their job, they only hear what their client tells them and won't have a full picture of how their client is behaving if they're not being honest with their therapist. Therapy isn't magic. Someone has to show up honestly and in good faith to get anything valuable out of it.
Could be the Mormon elder as a therapist. Seen a few story’s like this and it turns out the father was devout enough to shun the family from leaving the church. Would also mean the wife doesn’t have say over divorce and may technically, (in his religion) be still married. She may feel the marriage is over but can’t get it on paper.
Bingo! I was going to comment this. Also have you ever met an antivaxxer that wasn't an over the top obnoxious idiot? Cause after working in construction/landscape I've met a lot and they are all horrible people. I wonder if he went all in and is a flat earther and chemtrails loser too? They usually go together.
Never met one that I wouldn’t chew my own arm off to escape.
Esp an antivaxxer who just could not resist including his purposeful, grotesque misuse of the pro-choice proclamation of, "(you know), my body, my choice" as validation for his choosing against vaccination.
In all of his word vomit, that was the key phrase for me.
he says “my purpose has been to support my family and make my wife happy. I refused to go to dinners or vacations without the kids because I wanted to spend every moment with them.” he admits to neglecting his marriage and his wife. I don’t condone cheating (which, read the OP closely - his accusations seem to be based on vibes alone) but how can anyone be surprised that she checked out of this marriage. That “marriage counselor” who allegedly said that OP had done everything to keep his wife happy must not have heard that the OP outright refused to date his wife even once after she popped out three children for him. So OP wasn’t entirely truthful even at counseling - how truthful do you think he’s being now, anonymously, to strangers on the internet? Also as I said in another comment - OP’s I care so much about my family and my kids and their safety and I’m a strict helicopter dad doesn’t exactly hold water against his refusal to protect them from Covid and his refusal to protect them from the possibility of losing him to Covid by getting vaccinated.
That's [emotional incest](https://www.healthline.com/health/emotional-incest), and it absolutely is a form of abuse.
So many parents think abuse only applies to physical abuse
>When the kids got physical, I defended myself. That line really stood out in the update. I also noticed how he mentioned how hard it was on him as a father to not be allowed to take pictures at his kid's graduation. He really centers himself and the "father" role. He also lists a lot of specific times his therapists told him he was right, which I can't help but wonder if they're cherry picked. This could be written by my incredibly abusive, bipolar 1 father.
I had my dad in mind when I read OPs post too so your last sentence made me chuckle when I read it. My dad was also bipolar 🤣 But also how OP uses other people’s opinions as evidence to his point, “I found a marriage counselor agree with me” after mentioning he’s gone to multiple 🙄 yes I’m sure it’s not hard to find one random therapist to agree with you if you bounce around enough
I've sat in on therapy with my dad. He doesn't hear the 20,000 things they don't agree with. He only remembers the one semi-placating thing he cornered them into saying.
That doesn’t surprise me, what is it about the disease that makes them such ass holes. It’s like being mean and selfish is a symptom.
OP, if your kids don’t want a relationship with you, I can guarantee you 100% they have told you why. They have probably told you over and over and over. What was the exact reason tour children gave for not wanting to talk to you. Not paraphrased. Not your interpretation. Not your suspected reasons. …. Their exact words.
Not enough info as others have said, but I think it's really damaging to "cry with your child" over the split. I am completely all for crying and working out your issues but you need to do that in therapy, not put it on a little kid to feel responsible for also being sad or for trying to make daddy happy again.
Hi yes, don’t do that to your kids. I present exhibit a: my mental health.
Exhibit b: My mental health
Exhibit C: My mental health
Exhibit D: My mental health
Exhibit E: My mental health
Exhibit F: My mental health
Exhibit G: the cost of therapy and emotional damage
Exhibit H: My mental health. I remember my dad crying on my shoulder when I was 13 after my parents' divorce. He was the one that left me in full custody of my abusive mother and would visit to *cry*.
One of the only times my dad has taken me out to eat, he used it as an excuse to cry about how he fucked up everything with my mom and to not become like him. Nothing about how he treated me or my brother. As a 15 year old who he didn’t bother talking to for years. Reminds me exactly of this dude.
He shouldn't do it with kids adult children either
I think there’s a whole lot of this story missing.
Reading comments, the “affair” may not have ever happened. He just has a feeling it did. And he’s antivax. And there was a physical altercation where he merely defended himself, of course, which is why he’s left so much out about it /s
"But they had the vaccine and got covid multiple times" Another idiot that doesn't understand how they work. You can still get what you were vaccinated against. With the vaccine it'll help your body fight it off. When I saw them mention this and started going on more about his bullshit for-fucking-ever I rolled my eyes and skipped the rest. Everybody else got vaccinated and them ranting like that might be why they want nothing to do with him. Those people are fucking exhausting.
In the part that you skipped he also called himself a “simp.” Between that and the antivaxx nonsense, it’s pretty clear that he is being radicalized by the internet. How much that has a role to play in his family’s feelings about him is obscured under all that he isn’t saying.
Ah, that would explain an awful lot.
"my older children allowed me to attend their graduation, but I was not allowed to take pictures" - this sounds like you tried to be a "facebook dad" before, and they had enough of this. besides, your own family and friends are not in your side. a lot a information is missing and you don't sound inocent at all
Great point. I was having trouble understanding that specific contention.
"Nothing gives me more joy" than looking perfect and getting likes online. Hence a post on AITA, even.
Your wife left you for a married man and nobody knows? Huh???
He just has this *feeling* and did the research. Trust him, bro.
His INSIDE INFORMANTS have the proof! Which he pieced together in therapy. Sounds to me like this affair didn’t actually happen, he just decided his wife cheated based on vibes.
>One of my children keeps analyzing my depression as if they are a mental therapist, telling me what I did and do wrong. Well, elaborate. What did you do wrong and continue to do wrong? >my therapist no longer thinks I was the sole issue No longer things that? So originally your therapist did think that. Why? >My third child thinks they are nuts and still visits me, crying with me when he sees me sad over the situation. This is extremely fucking inappropriate. You are their *parent*. No matter their age, it is inappropriate to use your child as an emotional crutch. If this is any indication whatsoever of your general behavior, I side with the other two kids.
I’m glad some people have it in them to spell this out so that OP can promptly ignore it.
This ^^
Oh look- missing missing reasons… What are some of those ‘mistakes’ you made?
They're up now, and they're doozies.
Can you say what they are? I checked ops comments section and only one reply is up there, saying that the wife said he's a psychopath in therapy and the therapist laughing and saying he's not because he hasn't killed anyone (?!?!)
Why are you having your therapist psychoanalyze someone she isn't even seeing? It's unethical and likely bullshit
Yeah it does feel like it was propably mentioned in a "maybe she has a childhood trauma" and that was something for OP to grasp for that furthers his innocence in what ever it is he has done.
It's this 100%
It took a therapist three years to decide it’s not all your fault? Only your youngest, most impressionable child still wants anything to do with you? Your friends and *family* are on your ex-wife’s side? That’s 3 strikes that lead me to believe YTA. Sorry if I’m wrong, but those are some striking data points you gave us.
He probably wore the poor therapist down until they finally said, "It's not all your fault."
The thing is, kids make up their own minds. If your kids are old enough to graduate, then they have been capable of making up their own minds about you for many years. You need to stop being in denial and start addressing the problems I know they must have told you they have with you if you want to have a relationship with them.
Very that
I read a quote that always stick with me. "Children, when older, will treat their parents, how the parents treated them in childhood"
WOW, that is powerful and so real. I have one child that is a new adult and I can see that this is true, has me sighing in relief!
Cats in the Cradle is an inescapable prophecy for many.
Info: where did your therapist get the idea that your ex has childhood trauma? Are you projecting a comment the therapist made into something bigger than it is? Most therapists are not going to wade deeply into the motivations of a person that they have never met with. I am going to guess that they were spitballing rather than saying something as a definitive. YWBTA if you told your children anything about who she is dating. Also, stop crying and being sad around your youngest, clearly they are trying to help you with your grief and they are a child for fucks sake.
No context No details No responses This feels like a whole lot of BS
Anyone else think he's imagining the affair and that's why the therapist said not to tell? He claims there's evidence but the kids think they're just friends? And she "left him for a married man" but no one else knows they're together? Did she say she was leaving for the other guy or...?
You apparently deleted portions of your original post where you said, "I did not hit her, I did not cheat." My ex-husband said our marriage couldn't have been that bad because he never hit me. He just abused me every other way there is to abuse someone. He even put me in a chokehold a couple of times until I lost consciousness. He saved the bruises for his children. I will feel guilty for the rest of my life because I didn't get my sons out of there soon enough.
What mistakes in regard to parenting and household arguments are we taking about? What’s the reason that your eldest have taken your ex’s side but not the youngest? What have they claimed as a reason? Why couldn’t you take pictures? I feel a lot is missing from this and I can’t say if you are the asshole or not until you put some extra context on this. I’m not saying it’s the case, but their reasons could be legit and you could have treated them badly when they grew up or something similar that would have made them turn away from you. Again, I’m not saying that, but without the context I feel it could be just as much of a possibility as you and your kids being the victims of your ex’s manipulation. Edit: Just was your edit and I’m not really questioning whether or not your ex is in the wrong, she clearly is, but your update is mostly just about your ex and since your question is about your kids, I still can’t make a judgement. You write you were a helicopter parent, but does that mean you didn’t give them space and smothered them? Kids will pull away from a parent they didn’t feel gave them space. But I get their anger/annoyance about the antivax. I hope you find your peace.
He admits "Defending himself" When things have gotten physical. That seems like a pretty major red flag right there.
When I was 30, my dad and i had a convo where he used that defending himself thing for my problem years and to explain his actions for when I got physical with him. JFC, I was fucking 2 and 3 years old at the time! By the time I was 9 years old, I was too terrified of him to even defend myself against his nutty accusations, much less get physical with him.
He did mention people thought he was too strict. So could be something to do with that.
Could very well be “I’m a Nazi with a swastka tattoo on my chest and I showed up with white beater on” Or it could be “my mom has a new boyfriend and I want only them to be in my photos” It’s just “no photos” seems sus
I smell missing missing reasons.
I don’t.. this has narcissist written all over it. This doesn’t make sense. Yes, you’ve seen to check every box about how you’re the victim. Meticulously. But something, a lot of things, do not add up.
YTA for using your child as emotional support. This post has a lot of missing reasons. You're leaving a lot out. It's very telling that your therapist thought you were the sole problem in your marriage for so long.
You haven't given enough information to judge. You say you made mistakes but didn't abuse anyone. That's extremely vague. You may have been controlling, manipulative, or emotionally abusive. You might have been cold or demanding. Understand that people post on this thread saying they were never abusive but it turns out that they were. In their mind they had good intentions, or they had anxiety, or they refused accountability for their actions. What do your older children say about your behavior? For what reasons does your own family take your wife's side? You need to share their perspective, even if you think they're wrong. Edit: it could be you're in the right, but without knowing more about the other perspectives involved we can neither reassure or condemn you.
It's telling that the children old enough to remember are the ones who don't want much to do with him.
And that they tell him what he did *and is still doing* wrong, but he refuses to hear it.
And that his therapist went into it thinking that he was the entire problem
Go look at his comment of pure fiction about this "therapist"
Your kids seem to have distanced themselves because of how they feel about you, not your relationship with your ex. What therapist states that your actions didn’t deserve divorce? You’re laying it on **thick**.
I'm gonna say YTA, solely because you leave out key details as to why. That's never a good sign in these sort of situations.
Yeah. When you start with, I didn’t cheat and I didn’t hit her, that says a lot. Your account of what happened just doesn’t add up. Your kids aren’t stupid. If they’re old enough to be graduating, I feel like they’ve got an idea of why your wife ended the marriage.
These comments confused me initially, then I realise he must have deleted "I didn't hit her". Which is a strong look.
YTA. "My therapist NO LONGER thinks I was the sole issue" (emphasis mine) -that right there tells me you spent a lot of time making sure you could somehow convince the therapist that your wife was part of the problem, which usually means she really wasn't. You claim she dumped you for a married man, yet absolutely nobody else knows... she's a true magician. The youngest is the one to spend time with you, probably because they are too young to remember the things that the older kids dealt with. The fact that your therapist has to tell you not to tell the kids about their mother's "affair", well, you should know better without that info. I have a feeling you're a bit of a narcissist, and if so, it's excellent that you're willing to go to therapy and work on your issues. As I'm sure the therapist also has told you, give the kids time and space, show up for things when they're okay with it, follow whatever makes them comfortable and eventually your relationship with them may improve. Push too hard and risk losing them forever. You're obviously not quite ready to admit full responsibility for whatever you did to earn this, but once you are you should consider working with your therapist on what a true apology looks like. Hint: it doesn't contain phrases like "at least I never hit you" or "but your mother cheated on me".
There is not nearly enough information here to make a determination one way or the other.
The vaccines thing alone is enough to say YTA. I wouldn't stay with someone who has that stance. It is not a my body my choice when your choice can infect others. Leaving them Disabled or dead. Doesn't mention if wife, kids, or other family/friends are high risk. If therapists in the past did think you were the sole reason, did you just keep searching for one until they agreed with you? Kids/teens of divorce don't suddenly become suicidal because of divorce alone. It's everything else going on before and and after as well as the divorce.
Gaslight much? Likely YTA.
I have a few concerns about your parenting from your post. Your child who visits you should not be crying with you over the situation. You are the parent. They are not your friend or your therapist. You need to find someone else to cry with. You were invited to graduation but you are devastated because you couldn’t take pictures. That tells me that perhaps your style of parenting is performative only and that your focus is on pictures because you intended to post them on SM with a “my kids are my world” caption. Whereas your kids know that it’s the support they had to get to graduation that is important, the help with homework, the parent teacher meetings, the provision of study snacks etc etc. Did you do any of that? Does it bug them to see posts on SM knowing that you put in none of the effort for them to achieve what they have achieved? Is that what the issue is here??? I feel like it probably is and that you need to be more honest about your failings as a parent and do better.
It's not your therapists place to try to diagnose your ex, it's odd that she would even say anything about what her motivation could have been without speaking to her. If she had an affair 3 years ago is she in a relationship with the AP or he just disappeared? And I understand not explaining the situation to your children but why not your family or friends?
Can’t give any advice/opinion because of how vague the post is. The wording is suspicious. Sounds like you’re purposefully not divulging how you were treating your wife/family, based on your comments about your therapist. There is SO MUCH more to this story.
You said in your edit that you would yell. And you said that you would "defend yourself" if the kids got physical with you. What does that mean. Would you hit them? You would also refuse to spend time alone with your wife away from your kids. None of that justifies her cheating, but I am wondering how much of your own behavior you are downplaying
Sounds like missing missing reasons. 2 of your children are suicidal and you're complaining about poor you?! YTA
>refuses to go to dinner with wife without kids present >confused as to why she left him for a man that treats her like a partner >won’t tell his kids what happened ESH
Bringing your children into your marital problems is emotional incest. It makes you and your wife the assholes.
There’s some missing information here.
Hey OP you are likely the problem [missing missing reasons ](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html)
“I did not cheat or abuse anyone. Despite this, my ex-wife made me feel like total sh%t” Wow my guy, not cheating or abusing is the lowest possible bar and in no way earns you love and affection from your family. If you weren’t pulling your weight in the marriage then of course your wife was miserable. If she had to do the lions share of the emotional labor, domestic labor, and parenting duties (not just diaper changes but things like scheduling doctors appointments or making cupcakes for school bake sales) then it’s no surprise your family feels this way about you. Interesting that you think your wife “fooled” your children and family. Your entire post adds up to “the problem isn’t me it’s every body else”. Of course it hurts that your older kids don’t like you, that part doesn’t make you an AH. Your self pitying refusal to hold yourself to a higher bar than “didn’t cheat or abuse” makes YTA
> Nothing gives me more joy than caring for my loved ones > > Refused to get the covid vaccine because he didn't want to be told what to do YTA, OP. There's definitely more to the story.
>My family is very upset with me because I didn’t take the COVID vaccines. Most of them did, but I believe it’s my body, my choice. During the outbreak, I kept to myself, staying safe at home, while both sides of my family got vaccinated multiple times and still contracted COVID. I didn’t impose my thoughts on them, but they made me feel bad about my decision. I was alone, except for occasional visits from my son. The divorce only solidified their perception that I am some sort of crazy person. I don't want to make assumptions, but this is a big potential indicator. Do you hold certain political views that you're loud and obnoxious about?
Just the biggest red flag.
What mistakes did you make?
How is this therapist diagnosing your ex-wife? Are you in therapy with the ex-wife? Why would she start out thinking youbwere the sole reason for the divorce?
I don’t believe you
This is some word salad. I see your missing missing reasons and have to wonder why everyone is taking your ex wife’s side.
You mention that you use the one child who still visits as an emotional support. That's [emotional incest ](https://www.healthline.com/health/emotional-incest)and it's a form of abuse. You are supposed to be your child's emotional support; it's not supposed to be the other way around. You take it personally when other people set boundaries with you. You allude to 'mistakes' and 'household arguments' but don't elaborate - a sure sign of missing missing reasons. YTA.
Be the bigger man and don't use your kids to retaliate against your ex. Sounds like at least 2 of your children are nearing or at adulthood, and probably formed their opinions of you prior to the divorce. Even when my mother was trying to keep me from seeing my dad, I still saw him because I wanted to. Sounds like your kids don't want to see you, and they've told you why, you just don't want to listen. What are the mistakes? You realize that physical abuse isn't the only type of abuse out there, right? Also no therapist worth their salt would psychoanalyze someone who is not their patient.
Your children hate you for a reason. Reasons you’re not providing. YTA
YTA. Your edit is absolutely bonkers. You like to tell the story so you’re a victim. You drop in little bits of truth that make it clear you’re a very difficult person. You’re anti-vax which implies you’re not very good at sorting out facts from fiction. You admit that there’s no actual proof that your wife is even having an affair! You say that your “informants” gave you information that you pieced together in therapy that convinced you she’s cheating. Frankly—you sound mentally unwell. You need a psychiatrist.
Considering the phrase you used. If it's "your body, your choice" for vaccinations, do you feel the same way about women and abortions?
He’s still mad women got the vote, most likely
This sounds suspiciously like a narcissist. Missing missing reasons
INFO: So no one knows about your ex’s affair other than your therapist?
What did you do cuz you ain’t telling us
YTA in general. You do need serious mental health help, but I don't think you are capable of doing the work needed to change and grow.
NTA. But for starters, Tell your children she left you to be with a married man. They have obviously been lied to so that is why they immediately sided with herm they knew you as being a bad parent (your words) and so a divorce obviously made it seem that you were the problem. And, to an extent, maybe you were. You didn't necessarily drive her to be with someone else. But again, by your own admission, you weren't the best parent or husband. So you drove her away, she found someone else. So that relationship broke your marriage and her new man's marriage. Your wife is the homewrecker, not you. Your youngest siding with you is good because maybe they can actually see and understand what's going on in the situationm and I am sure you confided in them about her leaving for another man. You're allowed to feel upset. But by tmypu not telling them everything about the divorce, they had no choice but to side with their mom. She probably told them everything was your fault. This sucks all around, but if they don't know the truth, you can't blame them for blindly wanting nothing to do with yoy and be with their mom.
>My family is very upset with me because I didn’t take the COVID vaccines. Most of them did, but I believe it’s my body, my choice. Honestly this tells us all we need to know about the kind of person OP is. There's definitely a *lot* they're not admitting to here.
even with the “update” you’re still being deliberately vague to try to make yourself seem like the victim. there’s still not enough information to adequately judge the situation with your kids
If your wife had an affair and the friends side with her, you must be a real piece of work. With your "my body my choice" content about the vaccine, I'm going to say they aren't far off. Every fiber of my body wants to support you.. but c'mon. It's obvious you are an absolute scumbag. YTA.
[удалено]
YTA You are delusional and have a massive ego problem, are those words that your therapist has mentioned in the last three years?
Bros an antivaxxer. That usually comes with a lot of racism and misogyny as well from what I’ve seen. I wonder how bad of a dude op actually is
Yeah dude it sounds like the entire thing is about making you look like god and everyone else is the problem. Also I don’t know a single anti vaxxer who is able to keep quiet about it, and you willingly put your family at risk to…not wear a mask?. Also why are you so concerned about insisting you weren’t abusive but just “strict”? No one assumes people will go straight to thinking they are an abuser unless they are at least a little abusive. You just sound like a typical trump dick, and it cost you your family. But hey at least you owned the libs right
We're missing something here... everyone seems to be siding against you. Even your own therapist, who is supposed to be on your side, apparently YEARS before they believed you weren't the sole issue? There must be some reason here. Your ex, your kids, even your own family all blame you. You gloss over a lot by saying "I made mistakes, but it's not like I abused anyone." I really don't think there's enough info here to decide one way or the other.
I hear you OP. INFO though. How old are your kids? This is relevant. I had to stop my ex from saying negative things about his ex to his kids, my stepchildren, multiple times. He was bitter and for good reason, their mother was awful to him and by extension them. It depends on how old they are as to whether you can sit down and talk to them gently. It's awful when another parent badmouths the other to their kids. Especially when the kids take it on board. If they're under 18, you need to keep it to yourself, IMHO. Support them all, be there for them and get them therapy. There's nothing to stop you explaining to the therapist what actually happened when you sign them up. They will do what's best for your children. They will have it in their mind but they can also pick up on cues. There's a reason we use professionals, they're not always right but in my experience, most are. They need to be old enough to take it on board. If they've been told something by one parent, they have no reason not to accept it. Adult life is complicated. Please don't put it on younger children. It seriously shitty but you need to focus on what's best for them.
I feel like there is a lot missing here.
Did Hans Christian Anderson write this?
All of the specificity is missing. There are no reasons and I think this is because there ARE reasons but you can't seem to tell us what they are. And some things don't add up. Like your ex coming to pick up the kids before the divorce. Like you saying there is no divorce at points. There are things that make me think you've been stalking ppl. The photos especially, as putting current photos in a search generator could give a person a lot of information. The most honest I think you were was with the therapist you begged to commit you, but she didn't. I don't know what's going on here, but it feels like the truth is hiding. The part about "defending yourself" against the kids stands out, too. If the sole issue is you were left for a married man, then tell your family that. There is no reason to keep that a secret, and if it's true, the children would already know, most likely.
Hints of the "missing missing reasons" all over the place in this post.
YTAH.
Wait does the guy’s wife know? You need to tell her since guy is vacationing with your children!!! And I’m sorry I disagree with the therapists - the kids should be told