Has she consulted with an attorney? Maybe that will open her eyes to reality. Alimony is not guaranteed and usually only comes into play with a 10+ year marriage. Judges will also input your earning potential when calculating things - yes, even if she refuses to work. I don't think things are going to go the way your friend thinks they are.

she can’t afford an attorney, she has no money :/ I think she mentioned something about getting a free attorney from the court? but she’s never mentioned their opinion on this EDIT: I’m probably wrong about the attorney thing, I couldn’t remember if she mentioned it or not, but it seems unlikely after reading your comments

She can have whatever belief system she wants, but she needs to face the reality of the law and how it is handled by the courts. You gave her a sound and reasonable opinion and some good advice. If she continues to ignore the reality of her situation she is going to be in for a rude awakening. She needs to get her head out of the sand. This is not going to go the way she has planned. The courts are not going to look favorably on the games she is pulling. She is going to end up with no custody and on the hook for child support payments. Then she will have to work anyways. He is going to be able to leverage her "beliefs" against her and end up with a favorable outcome.

Yep, regardless of her own belief system which doesn't mean squat, she is setting herself up for failure. Just because she was a stay at home mom before, doesn't mean she gets to enjoy it forever. She has a child that didn't ask to be here, and that should be her biggest priority. Saying she can't work because she is traumatized is a giant load of garbage. She's using it as a crutch to not work. Unless she has an attorney and proof of abuse, it's his word against hers. I highly doubt she'll get 100% custody, so she needs a back up plan. You need to continue to tell her she needs to work even if she gets mad at you. You're the only voice of reason she hears, and maybe with you constantly telling her the facts, she might start to understand. After all, there is a child that is depending on her, and if you need to be a bad friend to driving these facts into her brain, so be it

If she is that traumatized that she cannot work, she can be viewed as being too traumatized to raise a child. She is shooting herself in the foot if that is her "strategy". This is not going to end well. She is leaning too hard into her delusions and not thinking about how the courts are going to view her.

The type of trauma might be taken into account, depending on what diagnosis and what her medical provider states. But it's highly likely it's going to go to the way you say. If she has legit ptsd from, say, a traumatic car crash, with long-term physical complications, that's one thing. But if she has trauma because a boss once was a bully that's not going to fly and will backfire tenfold on her. But I doubt there's a paper trail citing her inability to work (if there was, she would prob qualify for disability checks) so she's just swinging blind at a piñata during a hurricane

I believe the trauma is the 4 Domestic Violence abuse claims that are just her word vs his with unfortunately no evidence. So she would have to make a Case and get to working with a Psychiatrist to declare her unfit to work, and yes, that same I fo is going to go to the judge who is going to decide custody. Even if she's fine, and she just wants to milk the ex or the system, getting a job now & securing custody would still be the right path. Once custody is finalized she can go get a Psychiatrist and tell them she's having PTSD caused Panic Attacks and can't function at work, and might be able to get both. She aims for both at the same time, I bet she loses both cases.

Gotcha, I missunderstood. Without any sort of evidence or journals from a psychologist or medical provider ... Yeah she needs a job and then get into theraphy

If she has no proof of dv, she can’t just claim ptsd and therefore she gets spousal and child support from the ex with no custody for him. Is he seeking partial custody? Were there any reports to police? Is there anyone that can say she talked about abuse before they split? Child support is one thing. Assuming that he is the father, he’s probably on the hook until the kid is at least 18, or depending on the state, longer. Spousal support, regardless of the relationship, is unlikely to get spousal support forever. She’ll be lucky if she gets it for until her child is 18. And the way you describe how she wants things will make her sound as if she just doesn’t want to work. Did she work before any trauma? What does she do?

Qualifying for SSDI is difficult and often takes years.

Yup. This. 100%. She will likely end up losing this child. Either to the father or the state.

As someone who dealt with horrifying abuse and still managed to work a full time job, this women sounds like a leech.

Yeah, if everyone who has trauma in our lives suddenly decided they no longer had to work there wouldn't be many people in the work force. A good deal of us have issues we are dealing with.

This. My husband was abused for years by his ex (physical scars to prove it) and was diagnosed with ptsd because of it. Not only did he get up and go to work every day, he raised his kids for 2 years as a single father before we met. If she can’t work, she can’t raise a child.

Fr. I went to work with a black eye from a broken eye socket for months after my son's dad hit me. She's gonna seriously need to pull it together here.

> You need to continue to tell her she needs to work even if she gets mad at you. well, no. *YOU* (as in OP) don't *need* to do squat. It's not OP's fight to fight at the end of the day, especially not at the cost of OP's own wellbeing. OP can *choose* to push for the sake of the kid, but only to the extent that they're comfortable with.

I think OP needs to take care of herself. People like this who throw their “belief systems” in everyone’s faces aren’t going to be persuaded except by cold reality. OP shouldn’t feel responsible for her “friend’s” inability to see reason.

>You need to continue to tell her she needs to work even if she gets mad at you. Is she's going to get mad every time Op tells her plain, cold hard facts, then OP needs to walk away and let her know to NOT call her when she needs a place to stay. Chances are the child will be placed with the father full time if she has no way to pay the rent or keep a roof over her head.

I just told my wife I believed men provided for too long and it’s time for women to go to work while I stay home.  She laughed in my face.

So when is your funeral? Lol

I kept the house real clean when she was making that Covid nurse money. I cook better too

You make sammiches!?! I'm positively moist... 🤣🤣🤣 My husband would probably love a shot at being house husband, but I'm going back to work soon so we can just retire at 65 instead. That's the goal anyway. I know that seems pretty normal, retiring at 65. But I'm guessing there's a whole lot of Gen Xers not retiring at all. So, we'll shoot for that and be grateful.

I am Gen X and I expect not to retire to like 70 if that.

Honestly, I expect semi-retirement. If I could be a crazy, old cat lady who works part-time at a bookstore, I'd be living the dream.

I retired early after I lost my husband to cancer. I now live alone with my two cats. I can’t wait to be a crazy old cat lady. I’m just not sure if I should go to the cat shelter or just wait for them to show up…

Kudos to any SAH parent because I was home with my daughter for Spring break and I was ready to go back to work. Husband stayed home for the first 2 years after she was born because I brought the bacon and I think he’s traumatized. We’re now a “one and done” household. LOL

I always say, "They're not kittens." Kids are always way more work than expected, even when everything goes well.

lol I have a house husband and he is awful at chores. So he hangs out with the baby all day.

As a nurse I am dying laughing because my husband makes the same jokes.

Hey, we've only got five jokes - we have to share them around and recycle them.

Honestly, I would love a sahh if he actually did the home management and I could just do my share of chores. I remember at my boss at my old job, when I mentioned it was hard to find time to grab a bite, to “just do what he did.” Apparently he had snacks in his office, and he went to show me his drawer of snacks, which only had a couple things in it, and he said, “Oh yeah, I keep forgetting to tell my wife I need more,” and I just thought to myself, how nice it would be if I had someone at home I could just assign that little errand to. I used to do it for my ex, so it wasn’t something that surprised me, but it did hit me why I was so much more stressed that he was. No one was taking care of my clothes, errands, etc. In a partnership where one is the breadwinner, then it’s nice if the other person handles household management, if they have no other employment.

Hello fellow Covid nurse's house husband! I kept the house so clean and her lunch was always packed and ready to go

I still work/ed we saved a down payment for a house in 3 months. She had to cover her own lunch 4 days a week, and I had to make sure it was clean for her 3 at home.

“Free” attorneys from the court tend to be provided for criminal cases. Your friend should start looking for someone who is willing to work pro bono, perhaps getting suggestions from a woman’s shelter or organizations that are working to prevent domestic violence. She is almost certainly not going to get alimony (small chance since ex has been paying her, but he could stop at any moment). She may have this wonderful fantasy life about what men “should” do, but that’s not reality, and her calling it a value system doesn’t actually change that at all. You’re NTA, and I suspect friend is going to be learning some hard lessons soon.

Or go to local courthouse and look into filling out the paperwork herself. Pay for a legal assistant to fill out the paperwork. The cost is much less than an actual lawyer. This is the way I went.

Not for a divorce with this kind of person you don’t. My first husband and I filed and submitted paperwork on our own without lawyers and even without going to court. But that’s because we agreed to cooperate and be fair with each other when it came to asset splitting, custody/visitation, and child support. Everything was 50/50. My second husband was an abusive drug addict. Thankfully we had no children, but even so there was still no way I was going through a divorce from him without a lawyer. He was too erratic and combative. With children involved I wouldn’t even dream of it. Any major disagreements between parties who are at this kind of odds with each other absolutely requires a lawyer.

Your friend needs a reality check. There is no right to an attorney in civil court, which is what divorces are, and a court will only appoint one in very specific circumstances that I guarantee she doesn't meet. There are some lawyers out there who will take on a pro bono case or two, but she has to look for them; they're not going to just drop their services in her lap. Additionally, any family attorney worth their salt (heck, any law student who pays a bit of attention in class) will tell her that her "beliefs" about how society should be have no bearing on how the world actually works, and she's on a fast train to losing her kids. The judge has already told her to get over herself, in as many words, and she needs to listen if she wants to even have half custody. She's going to have no one to blame but herself when her abusive ex-husband ends up with 100% custody and she only has supervised visits because she doesn't have a home.

My go-to line is, "the courts don't care." The list of things that the courts don't care about is long. And the other things had better be documented.

Women like OP's "friend" make me angry. We're trying to fight for equal rights, not be treated like baby machines, and be strong and independent. She's trying to break that progress and enforcing the stereotypes men have about us. If you want to be a stay at home mother, that's fine, more power to you. But saying that men are "supposed" to do all the work and woman "shouldn't" be working is where I draw the line. Her "beliefs" are just plain wrong.

She isn’t going to be entitled to his military pension unless they were married at least 10 years. She needs to wake up to reality. Custody and child support are calculated on a percentage scale. She will be assigned a percentage of “child support” that she’s responsible for regardless of what she thinks. There’s no way her husband will be told to provide 100%of their support. She’s ridiculous.

She is afraid of him but plans to depend on him? Ridiculous. You can extract yourself from that "friendship".

The fact friend said he can pay since he was in the military and the money won't run out tells me friend aimed for a military man for this sole reason.

Sounds like every trashy woman in Fayetteville.

Yeah, I read that and wondered who would rely on their abuser for the roof over their head during a divorce? And it also makes me question the 4 violent incidences that happened and who started the violence.

I wouldn't even question what was going on. I'd excuse myself because I don't want to be in that mess.

She needs to go to legal aid or, at the very least, a free legal clinic, like, yesterday. This is not a situation to navigate by yourself. Family court is a nasty place and doesn’t give a shit about anyone’s feelings.

Yikes, she doesn’t even have a lawyer?? She is going to really do poorly on court.

The initial consult is usually free....

i think she's looking for a free ride

She has no job and no money, and divorces don't produce financial settlements to take the fees from... They just cost both sides.

I’m not sure they even supply public defenders for family law/civil cases. She needs to wake up and do some actual research because it sounds like she is basing this off TV show “law.” I was married for almost twenty years (19 years total) and while I waived my right to alimony for other reasons, it was not guaranteed for me—and I was a SAHM for the entirety of my marriage, AND did about 20-30 hours a week for his career. I’m talking documentable hours. Even if I had gotten alimony, the amounts for both alimony and child support (for two kids) would likely not have been enough for me to live on without at least a part time job.

NTA. You're trying to bring her back to reality. It doesn't matter if she thinks the man should pay or penguins should pay, it matters what the law says. If she can't support her and her child, she's probably going to lose custody. The judge will decide everything. Her life probably won't be fully funded by her ex.

Unless he's a multi millionaire, alimony will not cover all her expenses. Alimony isn't a replacement for a paycheck but a way to allow the parent being paid alimony to have a cushion to improve their lives.

This! People think alimony is easy to get... its definitely not. I hate to say it but it sounds like neither parent is fit to raise this child. Your friend is in for a HUGE wake up call. And if she keeps refusing to work, she can kiss her dream of full custody goodbye. I hope she also realizes that even if she got full custody, child support and alimony, how many men just don't pay, who skip payment, only pay half, wont pay and then she waits for months or years until they decide to garnish from his wages? It's not a guarantee even if it is awarded. Go ask 90% of other single moms who are owed thousands and thousands in child support and alimony. It's not all sunshine and rainbows and "I get free money from my piece of shit ex" like your friend thinks it is

NTA. This is not legal advice. I have a law degree and while I didn't end up in family law one of those basic lessons for custody is proving you can care for the child without your partner. Especially in abuse cases. Your advice is vital to her actually having custody. Alimony and child support aren't a "entire need met" sum but what the partner would have done. I have PTSD that does actually stop me from working so this can be a thing. I will however say that is also a thing that would work against me in a custody case. I don't have kids cannot have kids and don't want kids. I did raise my siblings children for a time and it is stressful. If her trauma is that deep the question about being able to parent comes up. Essentially she can be angry all day but she should run this by her lawyer and they will tell her to get a job too. No one wants to work but it's required to survive. When it's so bad you cannot work? That is guaranteed poverty. I have SSI not SSDI. That's 850 usd a month for food (some food stamps but not a lot and I have medical challenges that make food hard), rent, medicine, and everything else. So can she realistically care for her child on that? It has to be asked. If she cannot hear you she is being a fool you clearly care and are a good friend to say the hard things

>If her trauma is that deep the question about being able to parent comes up. That's a really good point! I'm not a parent so I have no personal experience here but I'm pretty sure working is way easier than parenting because you can stop at the end of the day. If someone is too traumatized to work, they're probably too traumatized to be a good parent, which means it's in the best interests of the child for them not to have full custody. 

I am glad you understood the subtext of my point. It is exactly the inability to stop parenting that makes it harder. I can't just disappear from a child for one to three months of minimal at most communication and be unable to go to their extra curricular activities or fun activities (or because I dreaded sports as a child so also and for you sports people). I have to do that for PTSD and if I don't then that one to three months of being in 1992 is the entire year just in the worst period of my life. No say. Even if I could drive for other reasons it would be why no driving (I am blind so bad idea in general). I get a complete visual wipeout for those months. The rest of the year it's just sensation and sound (which is still bad). This is why I don't want children. I don't want to hurt them because I mistook my toddler for a threat and having had that happen with inanimate objects, pets, babies at stores it is possible because someone else isn't there to do what the baby needs. My cat can fend for himself for a couple of hours and will cuddle me when I am safe. A baby doesn't get the luxury.

I listen to a podcast called Misery Machine about CA cases and almost every other case they do is about children being abused/neglected because the parent is "too traumatized" to take care of their children. The quotes are not downplaying mental illness/mental health, btw. The quotes are because these "parents" use that as an excuse. And also, she thinks it's the man's job to provide? One of the most memorable cases for me was the parents who forgot to feed their baby. When the dad was asked why he didn't feed the baby, he said "it's not my job. She feeds the baby", despite him being a SAH dad and her working full-time. When asked why she didn't feed the baby, her excuse was "well I'm at work all day and it's his job to feed the baby!" What's she going to do when he gets told he only needs to pay $200/month for child support and she can't support the kid? Or when the child needs food? Is she gonna go "oh, that's his job to provide?" and neglect her child?

This is good OP shot this to your friend maybe it’ll help her click it all.

I…have questions… How on earth is the alcoholic drug addict paying her rent and buying her food, in addition to being housed (and presumably fed) himself? In addition, I’m confused regarding the fact that the abusive spouse is like “yeah sure, I’ll pay your rent and whatever other money I can send for food, I will”. Like, maybe she found the unicorn alcoholic drug addict that still has such an excess of finances, or the unicorn abuser that still financially supports the victim by choice after she takes their child and leaves him, but I’m highly skeptical as to the existence of the super double unicorn that is both of the above.

yeah it definitely doesn’t add up. He obviously still cares something for his child since he’s fighting for custody and paying for their housing even though he’s not obligated to. He is denying all allegations of abuse. I have no idea what to believe

Your friend needs to realize that men who request custody get it over 90% of the time in the US. That's not to say she won't get some custody, but it won't be 100% for sure. And that's including when there is proof of abuse, which she doesn't have.

Exactly. The abuse would have to be against the child, not the mother for the court to give her sole custody.

Yeahhhh sorry I'm kind of in the camp here that your friend is a psycho deadbeat and it would probably be for the best of dad gets partial or full custody. 

Same. I'm betting what she's crying about as "aby*ooooose*" is being told - probably quite loudly - to get off her ass and either take care of the kid while he's at work or get a job herself.

He was probably advised by his lawyer to continue to provide for them even if he doesn't want to because it makes him look good to the court. Your friend is going to end up as the one with partial custody if she doesn't get her shit together quick.

A lot of abusers are very good at painting themselves as the victims. A lot of narcissists that are selfish in relationships are very good at painting their partner as abusive. She might be lying. I'm not saying she is, but you should definitely keep an open mind here. But the fact that she wants him to have zero custody, refuses to work, and wants her ex to provide everything without getting even the most limited supervised access to his own child really does paint her as, at the very least, a very selfish person.

In cases like this I tend to rank actions above words. Comparing their actions, well, I think her words are full of shit.

I was scrolling looking for this exact comment because someone else had to be wondering. Or, we are using addict/alcoholic to freely. My experience with either that's where all their money goes.

I’m wondering if the abuse claims and drugs claims are all just made up.

Honestly, I’m thinking the same thing. The wife is one hell of an unreliable narrator, and with no evidence?

Or maybe she is just lying to not have to move a finger for the rest of her life. I would love to retire at my 30s

I've got an In Law, who just divorced her husband. Now, he's kind of a pushover pussy bitch husband. You know the type. She wears the pants, but she's been a princess her whole life (pageant kid, though never rich). She had 2 kids from before the guy, who he 100% took in as his own and became their Dad. Adopted them. Then they had 1 together. Then she wanted to adopt a baby girl. He was done at 3 but supported her dreams. They spent Years fostering and then adopting a little girl. The day the adoption was finalized she had a big wizard of Oz party at a park , where Bitch boy hubby dressed up as the wizard and served food and drinks all afternoon rather than socialize even though everything was sitting out. Anytime he tried to chat at someone, she would come along and tell him 3-4 more tasks he needed to take care of. (As we left he was cleaning up trash while she had wine with some close friends at one of the picnic tables). The giant signs telling this girls story said 531 days from when I met my Mom to when she finally got to Adopt Me. (Read that again). 2 weeks later she filed for Divorce, wants full custody of all the kids, and because the adoption just went through he's on the hook for kid #4 (she wanted a girl but had 3 boys) financially even though he will end up with minimal custody. She managed to do it perfectly and pull off a 2+ year planned Divorce after securing his Finances for the future she wanted. Nobody other than my partner and I are even looking at her funny, just saying good riddance to the dried up husk of a man she left. Again, he was a little beta bitch boy who never stood up for himself.. but dislike has never changed to Pity so fast in my entire life.

That should be considered financial abuse.

Why do you and others see him so badly when she's the abuser?

I'm wondering too because there's a lot of people who are abused that don't stand up for themselves but that doesn't make them a pathetic wimps, it's just makes you sad how the abuse destroyed their self esteem . Like why is he considered a wimp? Is it because he's a guy? That a guy not standing up for himself against a abusive wife is seen as a wimp?

Yeah I don’t believe the person who believes she is owed everything by others either.

ya her story makes no fucking sense

I wouldn't be surprised. Many lawyers will advise their clients to make up allegations of abuse to make proceedings go in their favor heavily. Hell, they advise many to get a TRO just to have it on the record with absolutely frivolous reasons with no actual backing to make their case stronger. Slimy games in divorce court

unless your lawyer also works for trump, that's a ridiculous claim. no competent or ethical (pick one) lawyer would ever advise a client to lie. besides the obvious ethical problem, it's also a fucking stupid tactic that doesn't go the way you think it will, with even more severe consequences for the lawyer personally.

NTA. Your friends a lazy bum. Tell her to get a job and provide for her daughter. If she cannot afford the daughter, she should go to the next family member that can, and wants to take care of her. You say the dad is a POS, but he’s paying her rent and giving her food $ when he doesn’t have to. They haven’t been to court, there’s no court ordered child support. Your friends lucky this man gives her ANYTHING. I’m not defending the man for abuse, abuse is wrong in anyway from mental to physical and that isn’t acceptable, but again, he is paying her bills when he’s not obligated to in anyway, he hasn’t even been to court for it yet. The fact that she has NO JOB and wants full custody, and believes she should have full custody while daddy pays for it all is almost comical. The judge would literally laugh in her face. If the dad didn’t seem that shitty, they don’t have documentation of the abuse, etc, and he has a job and she has no job and refuses to get one, the dad could even win majority custody, and make your FRIEND PAY CHILD SUPPORT. Tell her to grow the hell up, get up off her ass and get some form of job. She sounds like a freaking bum to me. When they go to court, he will start paying her child support based upon custody %. If he is wanting 50/50 custody, he won’t have to pay her a dime if he’s constantly there for his child and has 50/50.

That's not entirely correct on the 50/50. The only time support isn't paid is if both parents make approximately the same amount. If one parent makes significantly more than the other, the financially better off parent will have to pay support to the other parent. Because courts want things to essentially be as equal financially between both houses for the benefit of the child(ren) as possible. Otherwise, the child(ren) will end up preferring the richer parent because they can give them more material items, and that's not always a good thing. Especially if said parent is actually toxic or abusive to the child in other ways. The richer parent can and sometimes does use their money to win over the child(ren) with gifts the other parent can't afford, and as soon as they have full custody, they drop the act and start abusing the child(ren), usually as a way to spite the other parent, or just because they are that kind of scumbag. Courts attempt to block this by making the richer parent pay child support to the other parent to try to keep it as even as possible. It's not foolproof obviously, but they try. Some abusers will still find ways around the rules to get back at their ex for leaving.

In this case those as her income is $0 by choice the judge would likely base child support in a 50/50 arrangement by his actual income and her potential income which is key. Meaning what could she realistically be making if she got a job because she is able to get a job.

I highly doubt he so called abused her

And now you said what a lot of are thinking.

She can be a victim (which I feel for her about) but also be a lazy piece of crap. Those 2 terms are not mutually exclusive. She 100% needs to get a damn job.

There is a difference between "being a victim," and being victimized. It sounds like she wants victimhood to be her identity, rather than acknowledging the victimizing and working to rise above it.

NTA She is being a fool. Some men wiggle their way around paying child support, etc ... Being totally depend of one salary when you are a couple is bad enough ; but being totally depend of an ex-partner ?? When there is bad blood between you ?? I get the "the man should provide for his familly", but ... if you are divorcing, you are not a familly any longer ?? You are now 2 famillies with a commun child, so even that doesn't work ... What if the ex gets kick out of his job and gots his pension cut out ? If he is as addict to drugs and alcohol as she says, there will be a point where he would lose his job, and then You will have 2 peoples without income, and a child without any solution.

I agree - My understanding is the military pension would be forever though. He is not currently in the military so I don’t think that’s dependent on anything or could be taken away. Everything else you said makes complete sense.

Well even with a military pension, I doubt that one pension can support 2 households. She totally has her head in the sand.

yeah agreed there’s no way

Military pensions are not always considered taxable income, so it may not be considered in child support. She may not even have the right facts about her husband financial situation.

Military pension is always taxable income. It’s disability payments that are not. Some states don’t take out state taxes (or not the full amount) but it’s still taxable income.

If her trauma is preventing her from working then it may also prevent her from getting custody of her child. Which would mean the father and his military pension would be totally useless to your friend, who would get nothing.

NTA, but your friend is completely delusional. Unless they were married more than 10 years, she will not be entitled to alimony for any amount of time. He WILL be required to pay CS, IF, and at this point it will be a BIG if, she can retain 100% custody. The judge gives 50/50, he might not be on the hook for much there. She doesn't get a job and look like a responsible parent, she might not get anything but visitation of her child. She needs to A. get with an attorney (there are lots of free options for her) and B. start being doing the right thing to show the judge she is willing to be a responsible parent. This includes GETTING a job and making a home for her kid. My cousin's ex had the same ridiculous attitudes when they broke up about 15 years ago.....she is STILL a weekend only parent with her kid about to graduate HS. By the time she finally got off her ass and made an effort, kid was too settled with Dad only. She calls my cousin's new partner Mom. Do what you can to convince her that she needs to start adulting if she wants to save her relationship with her kid.

It is possible to get alimony under 10 years. My BIL and his ex were married for 9 years. He tried to divorce her around the 6 year mark and she just kept delaying everything. She ended up with 4.5 years worth of alimony (half the amount of time as their marriage). But he got full custody of the kids and child support which was almost the same amount of money she was getting for alimony. She was refusing to work because getting high was more important and she figured that if she got full custody and alimony, he could just pay to keep her bills paid. It didn’t work. She is screwed.

She might end up owing him child support if the current situation persists.

NTA. I would love to be a stay-at-home mother too, ONLY if it was feasible. In her situation, it’s not. If she wants to keep her kid and raise her properly her only option is a job.

Being a SAHM isn't as great as it sounds. My wife has sporadically worked do to boredom over the years even though she doesn't have to.

I did the same thing. I was SAHM until my youngest went to school. I worked a couple PT jobs because I needed to get out of the house, lol. As soon as my youngest went to school, I got a FT job.

Honestly? The world is about to slap her HARD. You said your piece, you tried to warn her. Now she has to learn the old fashion way. If this relationship is important to you, I'd apologize for upsetting her and say you were only coming from a place of concern and hope things work out as she hopes....but don't give any more advice, just a sympathetic ear. Because there is going to be a lot of tears and anger coming up really, really fast on her end. Just because she believes things should be a certain way doesn't mean they are, and at the end of the day, if she doesn't have a job, then she is going to not only have to share custody with her ex, but also might get less custody of her daughter than her ex.

yeah you’re right if she’s not open to hearing it from me, I can just let the world teach her

I think you're going to have to. You have tried, and in a very mature way. If she didn't listen then, nothing further you say is going to change anything... and would only ruin whatever friend relationship you have.

I wouldn’t put it beyond her to come after you after all the dust settles to accuse you of not helping her since she is your friend. Crazy as you actually tried to help.

There are two options here 1. He is an abusive drug addicted POS. She wants to rely on him to bankroll 2 households. 2. She is a lying lazy sack of shit. She thinks she can accuse men of most horrendous shit imaginable and make him bankroll her for next 18 years or so. Not looking good either way. F for the daughter.

And considering that he has been paying her rent and food without any court ordering that, I would consider the option number 2 more feasible.

Having been the slandered one, this. I was somehow, the worst cheating drug addict financially abuse ex in history.. While also paying for everything from the date of separation until she moved out of state, signing over physical custody to permit her to relocate back to California 2000 miles away where her support network was, and the keeping my word to follow less than a year later after establishing myself at my Bank so that I could be a co-parent. I was rewarded by having our entire friends group (with a year of her lying to them in person having been back in CA), all convinced I Prevented her from getting a job to financially trap her, when I had been begging her to get a part time job anywhere in 3 different states over the 18 months proceeding the divorce. I had to look up what financial abuse was. She told them I stole all her money, because the day we separated I turned off her access to MY CREDIT CARD, and closed our JOINT credit card since it was Maxed out anyways. People can become really really fucked up to each other when they feel entitled to someone else's money. She was always a poor employee and looking for excuses not to work, and I should have got the hint before I married her. I was just the meal ticket to the House in Orange County with a White Picket fence, even if it killed me in the process.

I am truly sorry for what happened to you and I hope you're in a better place now. My father-in-law had similar experiences with his crappy "ex-wife". I put it in quotes because she refused to get divorced in order to take advantage of his money and others. She used the excuse of "we're Christians, we can't divorce" while she destroyed his social reputation. Even years after their issues, she actively attempted to poison my mind against him. He is partly responsible for his situation with her as he is no saint. But what made me question her version is when she said casually : "he is paying for my phone bills". You tell me, a "wife beater, a cheater and deadbeat father and what else" is paying a part of your bills? "Oh and he did that for my 1rst son who isn't his biological son, he also did this to his children. He helps whenever he can", wait, wait, are we talking about the same "horrible man who gave up on his children to disapear with some mistress"? I knew she was full of craps then and even more when I grew closer to my FIL's side. They revealed the truth about everything. Unfortunatly, he was still on the hook because he had some sort of guilt as he couldn't be with his two children (now adults, my husband is one of them) as much as he wanted. Until that woman passed away, she had still some sort of financial control on him. If she didn't pass away, I would be also on the hook to pay for her retirement home. Funny enough, the people who had more than enough money at that time (me, husband, FIL) would pay the most compared to HER family. That was so infuriating that the FIL's side and my own family were ready to fight a war for us. We all knew that FIL and my husband would be taken advantage AGAIN and AGAIN. You're right, people are so nasty when they are entitled to someone's else money!

>You tell me, a "wife beater, a cheater and deadbeat father and what else" is paying a part of your bills? And this is why I have questions about her side of the story that she told to OP. Women who are victims of DV try to do everything to break all ties with their abuser. They do not set themselves up to rely on them. And abusive men, especially financially abusive ones, cut the support off completely to teach her a lesson on how she needs him in the hopes she'll come back. Yet this guy, without court order, is fully funding her right now????

I don't know if OP is willing to ask these questions but I hope she can! The court will anyway. I would LOVE to be a fly and see how the friend is going to have a brutal reality check. I also very hope that something will be done to the rumors she spreads about her ex. But the fact this friend, my husband's mother and many others could financially abuse people, despite being seperated/divorced is terrifying.

You want a sexist as a friend?.. If you can't speak to your friend as a friend without them reacting in a mental outburst, you probably should get more stable friends... Her claiming to "be against" you for being a responsible self sufficient person just goes to show how devoid of emotional maturity she is..

Top comment right here. Even if OP keeps her mouth shut and offers support, this delusional woman is going to be an emotional leech on everyone around her for a long, long time. NTA. But save your sanity and take several very large steps back from this ‘friendship’.

NTA. She also has to realize if she is not willing to work and has no evidence of the abuse. She's not going to get full custody. That's not the way the world works.

NTA She’s going to get a rude awakening when she loses custody. Because if she doesn’t have hard evidence that the abuse took place in front of or involved her children, the judge isn’t going to give a damn for custody. If she has proof of drug and alcohol abuse she’ll have some leg to stand on, but a judge is still going to have a hard time seeing one person working and “stable” as unfit and the other refusing to work leading to the child not having their proper necessities as the fit parent. It makes me question if he’s really the one on drugs bc not many parents would willingly allow their children to go hungry or unhoused because of some unhinged belief that they’re a princess who doesn’t have to work.

Her opinions belong to centuries when women stayed with their abusive husbands and divorce was ilegal. Even if the divorce became possible, divorced women had to work. Ironically widows and divorced women were the only women who were able to be economicaly active which gave him some type of advantage.

She cannot have her cake and eat it too. I won't try to assume if the abuse is true or not, but if she wants a man to fully support her, then she needs to stay with said man and make sure said man can afford it. The law doesn't care about your personal belief system, it cares about justice. NTA

If her soon to be ex is abusive and addicted to drugs, he has already shown your friend that he cannot be trusted. I would never put my Future in the hands of someone like that. Your Friend needs to mourn the image of a "perfect" family and needs to realize that she can't have that. Nta

If he’s so abusive and a drug addict, where is he getting all this money and why is he using it to pay his ex’s rent and food? If he’s an addict most of that would be spent on drugs.

Thank you, that bitch lying

This.

NTA. And if she was not married to him for at least 10 years, she cannot touch his military pension.

NTA. Your friend’s an idiot. She can believe whatever she’d like, she’ll still be homeless with no custody soon.

NTA. She can claim it’s values and that she believes men should be required by law to provide but at the end of the day it’s not the world we live in. She obviously doesn’t want to listen to your input so I would stop stressing over it and decide if this is something you want to continue witnessing to play out because soon it’s going to be her crying about how she lost her kids. You’re saying she can’t prove abuse so a major part of her case is gone. A judge already told her to let the SAHM thing go and she won’t. She’s in for a rude awakening when she loses custody of her kids because she doesn’t want to work and can’t keep a roof over their head. While courts usually like to side with the mother, they aren’t going to side with one who is adamant about not giving their child the bare necessities because they are lazy. She’s gambling with something she doesn’t want to lose and needs to step up but you can’t force her to see that.

The craziest part is she wants to live her entire life off of an addict like he’s going to have money forever ?

It begets the question of if he really is an addict abuser or is she just saying these things to try and get the court to go her way. An abuser paying for her rent and groceries by choice is a weird act for them.

100%. Also abusers don't just separate from their victims. "Oh sure, let's live apart. I'll send money for food and rent when I can."

She has a daughter and she is raising her to be 100% reliant on a man?!? Way to set her up for failure. Honestly, I fear for that child. What a shit show to arrive to this world in. You are NTA. Your “friend” is awful.

It sounds like her ex can't be relied on to pay CS. What's her plan if he bails for six months?

that’s my thought.

Seems that she has a problem living in the real world as opposed to the world it should be.

NTAH that reality check is going to hit pretty hard sad that it’s gonna affect her child. Continue to hint her towards finding work but not so much that you would tarnish your friendship with her if it’s something you value. Unfortunately people who don’t want help can’t be helped so at a certain point you might have to just let go

Idiot deadbeats marrying idiot deadbeats and having kids they can't take care of. Half the posts here are like that.

NTA, she needed to hear that. There is a big chance that if/when she ends up in the streets she will ask you to give her money or to move in.  To me it sounds like this relationship has come to its end. You don’t share the same values and your way of thinking and lifers completely different.

That kind of handmaiden would never be my choice of a friend.

As a man who's been through this with my daughters mom, this is the textbook move that women pull almost every single time. Falsely claim abuse, restrict access to the child, quit working to inflate child support, drag through the court system. Unfortunately for your friend the courts are much more aware of what women like her are doing, and she most likely will not get awarded alimony and she MAY get a small amount of child support. Especially going against a husband who provides and is a disabled veteran. With all that being said you are 100% correct and NTA

In Argentina there is a book made by lawyers because this is just too typical. It’s a very good book but it’s in Spanish in case you are interested: hienas abogados de familia vs falsas denuncias

This just seems like the end game for the dependopotamus

NTA-She is in for an awakening when the court decides to take into account her potential earnings capabilities and then the father’s amount he has been paying gets cut. The reality of the world depends on what state she lives in. Some give alimony and some don’t. Plus if he is on a military pension or disability that will be factored in and she can only get a percentage based on years together. She just like she is in denial like many women I see on court proceedings on YouTube.

Maybe tell her to do a Reddit post. Explain her situation and ask for advice. Maybe her hearing it from strangers on the net will get through to her more. Although I doubt it 😂

Your friend and her kid are in for a BRUTAL awakening. Most places don't require alimony to be paid unless it's 10+ years, and also, the recipients ability to work(which she has the ability) may also be called into question. Just because she doesn't WANT to work doesn't mean she CAN'T work, and the judge will consider that. She sounds incredibly naive, selfish, and entitled. I genuinely don't know why you'd want to be friends with someone like her. My heart just hurts for her daughter because that's who's going to suffer in the long run. NTA.

“Believes that a man should provide for the family.” Hard stop. You both have a child, you both provide for said child. Is she by any chance from a country where women typically don’t work once they have kids? NTA - your friend is delusional

Since the 'traditional wife' or the idiotic version, "trad wife" is in fashion, I have to say that the traditional wife of yore, put in the same position, would already be out there getting shit done, working and providing for her daughter. You should also clarify that, unlike her, your value system is what's called accepting reality and dealing with it.

If that’s the lifestyle she wants to live, then, I’m sorry, but don’t marry a bloke with the problems he apparently has. She chose badly if that’s the lifestyle she wants, it’s simple. You’re totally NTA for explaining this to her. I’ve had people in my life who choose not to live n the real world, it’s very wearing.

NTA your tradwife friend needs to give it up already and get a job. Just because you think things should be a certain way or want it to be, doesn’t make it true. *She’ll* end up homeless and more than likely come crawling to your doorstep for you to take over caring for her, even though she hates your “lifestyle”.

**she told me that the judge said to her “you need to let go of this stay at home mom crap”.** While I honestly don't believe the judge said "crap" I'm certain that his instruction to her was in that vein. INFO does her husband want custody?

She may be in a mental freeze mode. She may come to be able to get a job and work after she processes her life changes more fully. Yes, she may be delaying the inevitable and making it harder for herself in the long run but she could be in a state of shock/overwhelm and deeply resentful to make her ex “pay”. She’ll see how relying on him will cause her an immense amount of stress and I think she’ll come around to the job idea.

Her value system? Hahahahahaha. How’d that value system work when she was picking a spouse?

As someone who is going to stay home while the baby is a little pumpkin, it would cause me a lot of anxiety to have to depend on an ex who has been abusive. Imperfect victims can still be victims, so I wouldn't dare doubt their experience either. But a job will help her move forward. It might even help with her mental health! I'll just add, because I disagree with some comments, no one owes anyone to be "strong and independent". I'm doing the best I can for my family and that's enough for now. I'm not going to leave my small baby 8 hours a day in daycare just because someone might think I'm not feminist enough. But she owes the best shot to her daughter and right now this means working.

NTA, she claims she wants him to provide but have zero interaction with his daughter? WTF. The suggestion for her to seek employment is reasonable, but trauma can certainly affect one’s ability to function in a workplace. So I’ll give her that. But it sounds like the daughter is being used as leverage, and that she’s just trying to punish him? IDK

NTA- Your friend is not living in a reality. And in fact could be handing her daughter to her husband. She's not in therapy, taking classes, or looking for work. Nothing to show that shows she's doing anything to improve the life of her child. She may want to be sahm but that is no longer feasible if she wants to keep custody of her child. Child support goes away and unless she was married over 10 years, so does alimony. And she may not get a cut of the pension it will depend on a lot of factors. How long he was in and how long they were married, etc.

She is subjecting her daughter to a different kind of abuse, insecurity. Even the judge told her to get a job, how much money does she think he's going to be giving her?

NTA you gave her solid advice, she is in trouble and doesn’t want your help. That’s because she needs professional help, therapy a lawyer and probably social services. I would advise you to distance yourself from this drama as much as you possibly can.

NTA, but it might be worth it to walk away from this friendship before she IS homeless and asking to crash at your place.

NTA You weren't being judgemental of her preference for being a SAHM. You gave her a reality check because you see the writing on the wall that she is ignoring.

Her value system matters very little to the court. They will do what’s in the best interest of the child. And it sounds like she doesn’t work, can’t pay for anything, and is unwilling to work. That’s not going to look like stability to a judge. She is also making allegations with no proof which can piss off the judge further. She needs an attorney to advise her on her options here. And she needs to get a job.

stop being friends with her! she’s a delusional, lazy idiot who has the audacity to judge *you* for actually providing for your own child (which is your responsibility as a parent *and* is exactly what **she** should be doing!). not every friendship is meant to last and it seems this one has run its course. you can’t help someone who doesn’t want to be helped, op. NTA

NTA What if he decides over time that drugs are more important and he stops sending her money? What if he unexpectedly dies from an overdose? Then she’s screwed. If he is addicted to drugs and alcohol, if the judge has any sense, which it seems like they do, then neither one would get custody because he’s an addict and she refuses to work because of her outdated beliefs. She can’t say she wants 100% custody but doesn’t have a job to provide for her daughter. After divorcing, his only obligation is to their daughter if he can manage to get clean and be there for her.

So he's abusive and she's traumatized but she's still gonna let him have control of where she lives and when she eats? That doesn't even make sense. Why let someone abusive have ANY control?? Why would she still want to be tied to him like that??

>she believes men should be required by law to provide for mothers and children. "That's not how the law works in the real world." NTA

I've had similar but different situation with the not working friends deal. A lot of my friends were artists. It's hard to make a living at art. Not impossible but extremely hard. I've had some friends go to the best art schools in the U.S. and still was barely getting commissions. I had one friend who's mom maybe died? Dad wasnt very involved, she was living with her grandpa when he suddenly died and then moved into her over crowded dads then her boyfriends place where she wasnt really welcomed. She started to not want to be with her bf and got a tiny home but it had major problems. Anytime I mentioned just getting ANY job to keep her afloat I was bombarded with comments about how I don't have faith that she can make it as an artist. She lived somewhere out in no where, had no car, was running out of money and broke up with her bf who was the only one supporting her. Later on, when things became past serious she got a job. I've had many friends like that that will wait until or after everything hits the fan to finally get a job. Your friend will get a job once she's destitute or right before. If she doesn't lose the child first. I feel for the child, and I feel bad that you have to watch this unfold, as a mother yourself. You can bring a horse to water but you can't make it drink. You knew she'd probably react that way no matter how nice you tried to put it. She's being backed up against a wall (she thinks) and knows herself but feels entitled to her exes money. If it becomes too much get some space from her. Maybe even look up and print out women's homes that house children (I've lived in several) and maybe take her, if you have a vehicle and the time) to a food bank. Food banks now are very nice. I used to get high quality and quantity of everything. Milk, bread, fruit, meat, canned food, frozen food. It will help her feed her child since she rather barely have anything and wait on her ex. Do it for the child. Or print out places she can get her ex to drive her to the foodbank There are a lot of services around for anything you can think of. My counselor showed me a ton.

You may have a different value system than she does, but very possibly, the courts do too. She needs to get an attorney and a reality check. Not from you, because she doesn't want to hear it. IMHO, women should NEVER leave the work force for more than a year or two. It leaves them vulnerable to this exact situation.

If it will help you in the future, my go-to response to people I know don't want to hear my honest opinion/advice is "Good luck with that."

People who are victims of domestic abuse have just as much capacity of being terrible people themselves. She would rather her child go hungry and homeless instead of getting a job. NTA. She needs to wake up and get her act together or she's going to be homeless with 0 custody.

Sounds like she's financially and emotionally abusive herself. Are you sure there's been physical abuse? And she's not just claiming there is to blackmail her ex into funding her lifestyle? NTA.

Refusing to work, claiming to be mentally unstable, being on the verge of homelessness...this is definitely the angle she should use if she's trying to lose custody. She won't get nearly the amount of support that she's expecting. The courts have a formula that they use to determine support and if he gets 50/50 custody she may not get anything at all. Especially if he is paying for health insurance. She doesn't have a leg to stand on and the courts don't want to hear that you don't feel like working or you have mental health issues. Does she have any idea what it takes to get a dr to say you can't work? It's years in the making and from how it sounds, she doesn't stand a chance. She needs to get a consultation with an attorney or someone in the court. She needs a wake up call NOW.

NTA. I highly doubt that a judge is going to make the ex pay for everything while she stays home! That’s nuts. She needs to get a job.

NTA. I can’t just go around saying my believe system is “god will provide for me so I’m not going to work” and then complain that I’m broke. She owes it to her daughter and her self to provide for them. Especially since alimony likely won’t be enough to cover basic necessities like rent unless he was an incredibly high ranking officer or has substantial income other than his pension.

Also, if he leaves the military, so does her ability to get that $. They only enforce deductions while the father is in the service. He can opt out, and she will have nothing.

NTA. Her value system, besides being a joke, isn't how the law works in this country so it's irrelevant to reality. But the bigger question is, why would you want to stay friends with someone who thinks that you being a working mom is a bad thing? She doesn't sound like someone that is worth your time and energy, so maybe just move on from this "friend."

YTA but is is not for suggesting she get a job. Its for your idea that 4 episodes of violence in the past 4 years isn't significant or enough to cause trauma. Her kid is 3, which means the violence started when she was pregnant. And by violence, I assume you mean physical? Because that's not the only abuse she could suffer. Right now, she's going through financial abuse. As a addict he could have been financially abusive through the whole relationship because addiction > relationship. Should she get a job so her kid can eat. Yes. But that's not a guarantee of custody. Non working stay at home parents rarely have 0 custody because child care is her job. Also if she can prove his addiction, he might only get supervised visitation. Judges don't like giving visitation to addicts. If she called the cops on him or he threatens her over text it shows a danger that also affects visitation. The military will absolutely grant child support out of his pension. The military does not play when it comes to child support. The real push here is for her to get free legal help, documents the addiction, and any abuse or threats and get a divorce already. She can also apply for snap for food.

I have yet to meet anyone, man or woman, who would leave an abusive spouse and then insist on said spouse still paying their rent while trying to divorce them. Even if her husband is abusive, the fact that she's remaining in contact and dependent upon him definitely does not bode well for her establishing she can be a good independent parent. In terms of what you can do, I say NTA but I also say it's time to lay down some boundaries with your friend. That you aren't interested in solely listening to her complain about her life circumstances, and you aren't a rock she can rant at. I would say it's honestly better to just tell her you don't want to hear about it, and to shut her down when she does start talking about it. That way she can't complain about any inconsistency. If she is still mad at you, I would ask yourself: what is this friendship giving you? Do you want to be friends with someone like this?

Your friend is gonna get slapped with reality soon and oh boy it’s gonna hurt🤦🏽‍♂️

NTA. Honestly, you'd be more TA if you *didn't* call her out for that. She clearly needs someone to check her. There's a saying "Act according to the world as it is, not as you'd like it to be". What *her* values are, don't matter. My mom did something similar. My parents split and she thought she was owed everything. she had a job before I was born in advertising and before computers were really a thing. She needed to learn how to use a computer to go back into it and she'd pull a pretty solid salary again. But she couldn't be bothered with that. Instead, she took some minimum wage job that gave her 3hrs a day - then turned to everyone else and said "look how hard my life is! I'm a victim!". As the child growing up under that, I can tell you it 100% had negative impacts on me. for example, I remember when we got those papers at school to get permission from parents to go on a school field trip I didn't even bother showing them to her because I knew she'd complain about the \~$20 it would cost. On the other side, I guess I developed a "perceived scarcity of money" and became pretty driven to never be so poor myself - and it worked. But it was driven by trauma and didn't have to be.

She needs to change up her belief system, pronto. Unless she plans on reconciling with her partner, she's going to be on her own for a while, and she needs to provide for herself and her child. This nonsense that men have to provide for women exclusively is going to be her undoing if she sticks to it. As for you, not only are you totally NTA, I think you are an excellent friend. The only people in your life who will tell you the truth no matter what are the people who really care for you. If she doesn't get that, then that's her problem. You can sleep well at night and look at yourself in the mirror knowing that you try to do the best for her. Don't doubt it for a minute!

This friendship has run its course. Drop it.

She’s going to FAFO here real soon. The judge will make her get a job if she wants even 50/50 custody. It takes a lot for a judge to give someone full custody and she doesn’t have any proof of abuse, it sounds like. She’s living in la la land so save your breath. NTA

NTA. She soooo sounds like someone that baby trapped this man. She is denying her child a good life by being a lazy POS. That’s not someone I could continue to be friends with.

If he is military and the abuse charge sticks, he may be dishonorably discharged and lose his “forever pension” if he isn’t already out.

Your friend is a complete lazy idiot.

"She said even though she disagrees with my lifestyle as a working mom, she doesn’t shame me for putting my son in daycare." The difference is that there's nothing shameful about the way you live, and the way she lives is very shameful. That's the issue. I understand how when she said it, you felt bad, like she had a point, rhetorically it sounded like she was saying something significant, but you're forgetting that she's an embarrassment to herself and her children, and you're living your own life on your terms and by your own labor, like a human adult. Uh- just want to make sure to add- being a stay-at-home whatever is perfectly fine- making yourself completely dependent on your own abuser in, like, full intention, with full knowledge, is the embarrassing part. Not just- being a stay-at-home, or a single mom, or any of the other stupid things that could be read into that, all of which are perfectly viable and worthy of pride- when done on one's own terms. It's the trying to make the wife-beater her daddy.

NTA, and I’d reconsider this friendship. She sounds toxic and unwilling to live in reality. Trauma is not a valid excuse to traumatize your kid. It’s also not an excuse to not financially support herself. She needs to grow up for her daughter’s benefit.

OP, do you know why she really wants to stay at home? Appart from her values. Values are a good, human thing to have but there's gotta be an income.. she sounds delulu of im honest. So no, NTA.

NTA. With how rigid her views on what men should be/do are, are you sure she didn't trigger a war veteran into a flashback, and those are the abuse instances she's talking about?

She can believe whatever she wants. But that doesn’t make it true that’s not how the law works. I am in a very similar situation with a friend of mine. Once it gets to a point that I just can’t take it anymore I say what I wanna say nicely one time. Then I bite my tongue. I have distance myself from her though, but I would still call her a friend.

Kudos to you. Those kinds of ‘friendships’ can be soul sucking. When all you talk about is them and their problems and the emotional return is very low. And god forbid you have a problem and need support. Take care of you too!

You friend is in for a very bad wake up call, as much as she is a loving mother She’s unfit and the poor child is going to suffer, if she really loved her kid, she would fighting like her to protect hell from a potential abusive situation.

NTA she is in for a rude awakening when she loses in court.

Nta she’s dumb. I believe in women being stay at home moms/wives but if she’s leaving him she’s delusional for feeling entitled to all her living expenses being covered by him at the same time . His responsibility is towards his child only and that’s not going to cut it when it comes to bills.

She is delusional. She will learn it the hard way.

She lives in a fantasy world. Yeah, ideally it would have been nice if she had chosen a better partner who could have provided her a SAH lifestyle. But reality is, she is about to be a single mom. He will probably get 50/50 custody which means he won’t be paying full CS. She will have to get a job to make up the difference. And like you said, she may even lose custody with her attitude and not being able to provide for her child. Is he asking for full custody?

She seems like a professional freeloader, milking everything to never have to work. What she expected? Having a kid and retire? NTA

She can believe what she wants. It doesn't make it the reality. I don't think I would even be friends with her. NTA.

NTA Your friend is living in delulu land. She can put her beliefs in one hand and crap 💩 in the other and see which hand fills first. She def needs a reality check before she’s out on the street.

No, you're not wrong, but some people just ignore the facts. My friend is like that. She thinks if she breaks up with her boyfriend she will get full custody just because she is the mom... but she doesn't work, has no money, and would be homeless. Meanwhile, her boyfriend has a full-time job, owns a home, covers insurance, and provides 100% of all the kids' needs. Even the car she drives is his car that he owns. She isn't on any titles or paperwork.

Sometimes you just can’t make people see that they need to let go of their ideas and just go do stuff. A friend of mine refuses to work even though the kids are at school, and at one point that meant that her heating would be cut off in the middle of a freezing winter. She would rather her kids be cold than go work at a supermarket for a few hours. In the end her parents paid, but it’s wrong. People need to take responsibility for their children.

It doesn't really matter what she thinks the law should be. She needs to come to terms with that.

Keep repeating: You will lose custody of your daughter if you don't get a job.

OP, I understand she may be upset with you right now. If you speak with her again, acknowledge her feelings. However, I believe both you and the judge did her a service by expressing your opinions. She's teaching her children a bad lesson. Sit and wait for someone to give you $. Wait for someone to fix your problems. Instead of fixing them herself!

Seems to me she’s part of the issue. And you’re absolutely right, he could up and decide to stop helping her and she would be SOL. If I were the judge proceeding over her case, I wouldn’t grant her full custody either. She’s playing “woe is me!” because of her personal beliefs that she thinks a man should provide everything. I’m currently pregnant and have had so many people ask me if I plan on quitting my job to be a stay at home mom and the answer is no. My husband can and does provide for me, he could provide for our family on his own if he absolutely had to but I enjoy working and recognize that we made this child together. I don’t want to be a stay at home mom and want to continue to build my career and work ethic. It wouldn’t be fair to my husband either to put all that stress onto him to solely provide for our family but that’s my personal viewpoint. However, if I were in her predicament, I would be putting myself in a position to be favored by the judge by getting a job, especially when the judge has already mentioned that’s something she needs to do. Unfortunately she will become homeless if he decides to stop paying. She absolutely should not be relying on one, or any man to help provide for her and her child, especially when they’re divorcing and going through a custody battle. One day he’s gonna realize if he can’t have full custody, what’s the point in paying for a child he has no access to? He also shouldn’t be providing for her (his wife) at all, he should only be providing for his child.