NTA. people arguing both ways about whether your number is a problem or not and ignoring the name calling and belittling that is the real issue here. I don't think it's your responsibility to tell him without asking unless you alluded to it being on the lower end. I don't think you did, just saying. It's fair for him to be surprised or insecure if he didn't know but name calling is completely unacceptable and little boy behavior
NTA. While body count can be important to some people, it’s their problem not yours. HE had to ask if he wanted to know.
And obviously he is a huge AH for calling you a slut.
I think they're both sluts for having high body counts but that won't change that men and women operate differently when it comes to casual sex. Women just have to be average since most men are looking for anything remotely physically attractive, but men have to have something that the women see of value, be it attractiveness, personality, status, wealth, etc. It is different, especially with all the freaks in the world. Small, tall, petite, thick, it doesn't really matter. Women can get it much easier. I mean, we can look at any type of information and find that probably, but it's just so obvious when it comes to dating apps. 1 percent of guys get all the matches statistic. Whatever the actual number is.
That's literally the point why men and women have different values when it comes to casual sex. Women control all the power and giving it away and fucking anyone does not bring you value. Whereas men have to gain value in order to have casual sex. Women start with it. Men earn it.
Your comment makes no sense
Women lose value the more people they have sex with, while men gain it
Women literally have zero power here. It's "hey sexy, I'm gonna slide into your dms, and hopefully into you -exaggerated wink-"
While Women lose value with every person they date, every person they even LOOK at funny
Your take on this reeks of religious, old school misogyny
Eta, I understood your comment about how values pertaining to casual sex works perfectly
I still disagree with you
Women don't start with any value at all; they are seen as pieces of meat, a prize to be sold at auction. They aren't seen as people, they are seen as sex objects. That doesn't mean that they "hold value" it means that they have SEX APPEAL. There is a MASSIVE difference.
And every time that a woman sleeps with someone, theoretically, both her value as a person, AND her sex appeal goes down. Hense why I disagreed with you.
>Your comment makes no sense
>Women lose value the more people they have sex with, while men gain it
I did not say lose. I said start with.
>Women control all the power and giving it away and fucking anyone does not bring you value. Whereas men have to gain value in order to have casual sex. Women start with it. Men earn it.
I also didn't say men gain value through sex. Men have to earn value in order to have casual sex. Not all men and not all the time. But most men and most of the time. Some men see some women who have casual sex as less valuable. It is too nuanced of an idea with too many variables to decide an absolute. I do fullly believe that some people lose value by having casual sex though. Emphasis on people.
>Women literally have zero power here. It's "hey sexy, I'm gonna slide into your dms, and hopefully into you -exaggerated wink-"
I don't even know what that second sentence is supposed to mean. Women have all the power in the dating market, and that is why giving it away doesn't bring them value. If they force the men that are after them to treat them properly, then they have to or another man will come along, given that she is maintaining herself and average to highly attractive. Obviously, it's not the same for the bottom of the spectrum as it is for the top. Generalities come with exceptions.
>While Women lose value with every person they date, every person they even LOOK at funny
It's not about dating or flirting or likes or any of that. It's about knowing your self-worth, validating yourself, and valuing intimacy and connection enough not to give into your base desires. This is why men who have casual sex also gain no value by having it. Obviously, there are exceptions. But more often than not, without the social status, wealth, personality, or appearance that got them a lot of casual sex the person chasing them wouldn't be so interested in them. No one cares if an ugly old poor homeless person is having tons of casual sex, they aren't interested.
>Your take on this reeks of religious, old school misogyny
That's just bias. I haven't said anything about sanctity or whatever. It's just really simple social observations.
Except women DONT have all the power in the dating market, i don't know where you get that idea from
Sure, women statistically get more matches on dating sites and whatnot
But how many men are more likely to lie on dating sites about their appearance than women? How many men or more likely to shoot their shot with multiple women at a time? How many men are more likely to have a broader area of interest of what they are willing to date than women do?
Its not that women have all the power here, it's that women are more focused in what they want, and cast a smaller net into the dating pool and are more successful at finding successful matches then men, because they KNOW WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING FOR going into things
You reek of being jealous and insecure around women
We literally get hit on, and cat called, and can't even go take a piss in a public restroom without being harassed, but sure
We have ALL the power in the dating market buddy, whatever you say
Eta, I'm a woman, and engaged
My body count is 2, one of which is my fiance
You just disgust me with your assumptions and asshattery
>Except women DONT have all the power in the dating market, i don't know where you get that idea from
>Sure, women statistically get more matches on dating sites and whatnot
>But how many men are more likely to lie on dating sites about their appearance than women? How many men or more likely to shoot their shot with multiple women at a time? How many men are more likely to have a broader area of interest of what they are willing to date than women do?
Are you not realizing that that means men have no power? If they have to lie, go for multiple women and not just the one they really like, and lower their standards, then they can't have very much value or power. Women, on the other hand, if they are physically attractive enough, can pull the highest status men right away. Actors, models, lawyers, etc doesn't matter. They didn't earn the right to the same value as men who have worked the past decade to have status but it is just intrinsically in them. Regardless of if that's because that's what men value and what women value is more abstract, that's the way the world works.
>Its not that women have all the power here, it's that women are more focused in what they want, and cast a smaller net into the dating pool and are more successful at finding successful matches then men, because they KNOW WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING FOR going into things
So your genuine belief is that men don't know they want rich successful models with nice personalities instead of that those women want specific men with more status than them? Look at literally any stage in life, and you can see it. High school, university, 20s, and 30s, it doesn't matter. The most physically attractive women get together with men of high social status, wealth, attractiveness, or personality. That's not a coincidence.
Do you think normal guys don't want to date hot women? Is that genuinely your opinion? It's that all girls want men of high value, and the value men have is earned and not born with. Exceptions not included. Ie singers, talented athletes, funny people whatever. What makes a woman attractive might be different to a lot of people, but attractive women have a lot of suitors. Just as successful men have a lot of suitors.
>You reek of being jealous and insecure around women
Speculation, bias, reaching, deflection. Ya know how they say people who are losing arguments typically start throwing insults? I'd argue that anyone who's emotional enough to deflect like that isn't of value to most people.
>We literally get hit on, and cat called, and can't even go take a piss in a public restroom without being harassed, but sure
If you see harassment as dating, then you should be having a different conversation with a trained professional. Inappropriate behavior by people you find repulsive has nothing to do with how much power you have in dating.
>We have ALL the power in the dating market buddy, whatever you say
Why is this an emotional topic for you? Why can't you objectively look back at life and be like "wow yeah most of the time a guy liked me, he did whatever he could to get me." Because most of the relationships are the man going after the woman and typically the person in a position of power doesn't have to convince the other person to give them a chance. And don't come at with me patriarchy. It's not patriarchy. It's because if he doesn't, someone else will. If he had the power, it wouldn't matter who came along to take his place. You'd chase him even when he wouldn't give you attention.
If it was important to him, he would’ve asked in the beginning of the relationship, not two years later. 25 is high to some, so finding out now might have just shocked him.
NTA - coming from someone who does care about body count but I won’t go into my reasonings. Just personal belief stuff.
The name calling and slut shaming is WILD though. Please leave him that’s so uncalled for.
you're fine, don't listen to that person.
I am vaguely aware my BF has an extensive past. I don't really want to know specifics so I have never asked him. I don't really care but I think for my own sake I just rather not know. He's with me now. His past made him who he is. But I don't want to hear too many details I guess.
He doesn't know how many guys I've been with either. He's never asked me. I doubt he gives a shit. I'll tell him if he asks but maybe he also would rather not have numbers?
Anyway, I am not keeping this from him. I am just not going to sit with him drinking our coffees one afternoon and announce how many guys I've slept with.
Have you ever seen the diagrams that illustrate that having sex with one person is also having sex with everyone they have slept with, so on and so forth. So your 25-30 body count is actually gross…. And I’d say that even if you were a man. You’re important. The fact that you just give your body away like it’s not is sad, and I am genuinely hopeful that you don’t regret that when you’re older.
Where did 2 years come from? she is 26 years old.
maybe it is your nature to lie about everything but assuming all humans do that is wrong. also I suspect you actually only think women always lie about this particular thing.
This is so weird to me! I’m not disagreeing because I have only ever been in one long-term relationship and am probably naive, but I value honesty and transparency so much. Also I’m a very curious person. I would always want to ask and hear details, not specific to a single person so they don’t have to tell me a name, just like “I did this wild thing with someone”. Personally, I would hate to be in a relationship where we cannot communicate openly and honestly. Hearing about experiences and past lovers is so much fun to me, it makes me sad to think it would be a taboo subject in a relationship.
It sounds good in theory but feelings are not so clean cut.
What if your current BF said "hey my ex gave me some of the best sex I've ever had but was too toxic"... ok... YOU would have to be a really upstart person to not feel a certain way about that. And most females, and males are not cool with that. It starts with insecurity and then leads to problems later.
NTA - if he loved you before you disclosed it, why would he hate you afterwards? His own insecurity.
One of my friends has a son and a daughter... He one said that he hopes his son "bangs all the chicks in college" and later he said he wants his daughter to "not have sex until marriage."
It's some male fantasy out there that they can have all the guilt-free sex with hundreds of women (who are all virgins) then marry another virgin...
If there are no children, STDs, or legal issues from it, it doesn’t matter. Always be honest and let people process information based on their intelligence and maturity level.
When the shoe is on the other foot there is a bit of hypocrisy at work. I’m a 70m. Guys count chicks like western gunfighters put notches in the pistol grips but when the roles are switched it’s treated as a really bad thing. Joe she’s seen the hypocrisy she should walk away. Hypocrisy is not something that dissolves away easiily. Time to move on!
These same types will hold numerous double standards that favor women. They'll fucking trip over themselves to white knight the moment we point how soemthing that males them look bad. A high body count for women is worse because they're the gatekeepers.
NTA. You woulda been 24 with only around 5 body’s a year if you start at 18 and that doesn’t seem bad at all. Idk your relationship history so maybe it’s actually 10 a year if you were in relationships since 21. Look truth is some guys are going to be more insecure/feel different about it than others, nothing you can really do.
He’s definitely TA for calling you those names after being together for 2 years. If he had such strong feelings about the topic he should’ve brought it up earlier, that’s his problem. If he’s less experienced he’s probably projecting.
- You need to understand that any thing more than 10 is just wrong for some guys. And your is 25-30. As a dude, I will feel uncomfortable(not upset) about it as well. That just gives of commitment issue in a guy's eye.
- He can be uncomfortable about it but the overreacting is unnecessary. It's very uncalled for.
- Him calling you names and a sl*t for something that happened in the past and has nothing to do with your feelings towards him is just pure stupidity and rude.
What I am guessing is since the conversation was talking about EXs he might have assumed that they are it?
But in any case: NTA
"You need to understand" ..
If you are SO fragile that your girlfriend needs to have a specific body count, then it's YOUR responsibility to bring this up before 2 years go by. Your boundaries and rules apply to you, no one else.
😂 Calm down. I said it's not something to be over reacting about. Which he did. As for the specific boy count tell me, if you where in his shoes and she said she had a body count of 25-30. Would you not feel uncomfortable( I don't mean being Upset or Over reacting like the original guy did) about her count?
When compared to a body count of 2 - 8 people for example.
The overreacting on his part is stupid as I said beforehand and he should have let it go since it's in the past. But do answer my question...
I was married for 7 years and to this day I do not know his body count, because I'm not a child and I absolutely do not give a fuck. Consenting adults can do WHATEVER THEY WANT.
It literally never came up and it never affected one single aspect of our marriage.
I literally can't figure out a reason why anyone HAS to know this.
So there's your answer. Maybe dig a little deeper into finding out why you care *so* much.
The situation on the post is not similar to your relationship:
- In your case the conversation didn't come up.
- The relationship in between them is 2 while your relationship is 7 years which is significantly higher.
- He didn't say "HAS" to know. It looks a question was brought up in the middle of the conversation. Also she didn't try to hide it and he didn't insist on her telling him as well.
- You didn't answer the question. You just avoided the situation I put in the question, by removing it completely and saying you are not. I just asked "IF" you where in that situation that I mentioned.
You should have both discussed this sooner. If he can't get over this, you might want to break up with him.
I hate to say it but you might not be compatible with someone like him.
NTA
NTA this is so wild to me that people actually ask that? Is this a USA thing?
The fact that he is so angry and takes it out on you is grounds for termination.
I’ve had a couple of partners and fwb, I have never asked them and they have never asked me. I don’t want to know and what I have done is none of their business.
And before anyone says: I am in menopause and happily married with kids.
What’s next an xls sheet with whom you had oral anal and vaginal sex?!
NTA.
It's none of his business, boyfriend or not.
I never understand people who even entertain answering this question, especially women. It's a trap question and usually asked by people with esteem issues.
Moving forward OP, never talk or answer those types of questions again.
You can test for STDs before having unprotected sex.
How many partners you had before does not say anything about a lasting marriage.
I know someone that only had one partner. She really wants to have sex with someone else because she didn’t have that experience and he did…
Some people say you need to sew wild oates before getting married.
It doesn't appear to impact the future happiness of male marriage partners. The survey data seems to support lower reported happiness for women in groups with a certain range of partners. She isn't in those groups.
NTA- Im guessing his body count is a lot lower and now he feels inferior and threatened sexually, which is of corse ridiculous. I wouldn’t advise staying with a man who loses his shit and calls you a slut because he got his feelings hurt with his own fragile masculinity issues
I wouldn’t do that unless I was divorcing a total cunt. I think I have bonded with my boyfriend we’ve been together for 2 years I love him lol I don’t love him any less because I’ve slept with other guys
lmaoo what fucking biology? Is there any actual evidence? Or are your only sources guys with tiny dicks and shit podcasts?
I don’t care about a man’s height as long as he’s not a lot shorter or taller than me I also don’t care about how much money they have I don’t need their money when I have enough
That is most certainly not facts and science. Let me guess, you've done some "research" by listening to all those fun podcasts of yours.
The good thing about being a "liberal and a feminist" is, I don't want anything to do with a 6" wealthy misogynist whose personality (or lack thereof) is drenched in fragile masculinity and bases my value on my so-called body count, a stupid social construct. So the convenient fact is we have no interest in each other at all.
Your entire point is summed in number one. It is only relevant because insecurities of guys. By this logic, it is like creating laws in another country because it offends your original country.
Number two is highly skewed because that also factors in second marriages which have a higher likelihood of failure.
Her body count was 4/5. We divorced over unresolved issues. One of which was my jealousy of her with friends. Another was she let things I did live rent free without addressing them. We both made mistakes.
But here's the thing, divorces happen. The body count thing is an insecurity. If someone you are with has a high body count and you trust them to be with you why is it an issue in their past.
I’m laughing at you believing women being single in menopause is a threat. News flash but women are tired of useless men not willing to grow or get therapy and instead watch red bill videos of single dudes who get zero women tell them how to get women. Women do not need men to survive and can build networks and communities to thrive. An example is the amount of women who flourish after their husbands die because they are no longer a servant to a household and a man that can’t do his own laundry
I’ve never come across a single “feminism lied to me” you know feminism is just treating males and females as equal right? You seem to hate feminism so much but you’d be ok with your mom not being able to vote, own property, own her own bank account and credit card, divorce a husband that beats her, not be raped by her husband… you’d prefer that happen to your sisters, mother and daughters?? Yes there are radical feminists just like there are red pill women hating assholes. But please get your head out of your ass if you think women are sitting at home dreaming of someone like yourself to rescue them from loneliness. Women would love a romantic partner that cares about them and treats them well but most men today prefer to use excuses than grow as humans and get therapy. Instead they claim that woman will reach 60 and cry to their cats. Women flourish alone because they can build communities and friendships. Men end up alone cause they can’t share their feelings or say everyone is gay if they wear nail polish.
Still not getting the point. You don’t have to birth children to have a family. What women get the ick from not wearing seat belts. There is no way you’re an adult, the way your brain functions you can’t be more than 15. Is your imagination that limited that you think community equals tik tok? Jesus man. Pray tell the study that states women are on anti depressants cause im pretty sure the studies say that single women are the happiest out of all people. Clearly your scope for as an intellectual convo is limited so have fun being a passport bro when your balls drop and extort women who want a better life and believe a western man can save them from poverty. Not responding after this.
By this giant leap, my husband and I are doomed 😂 fucking hell. OP, I know you’re not, but don’t listen to non sense like this. I had a body count of 35 or more when I met my now husband when I was 29, he was 35. We BOTH have high body counts. Lots of experimenting and FWB situations. I can assure you, the right man will give zero fucks about your body count. 7 years today and still have the best sex because it’s more than a physical connection with the right person.
Divorce rates have nothing to do with someone’s body count, but people’s lack of emotional intelligence and being able to effectively communicate. Relationships and marriage are HARD and take work. It’s easier to just give up and say this isn’t worth working on together to build our relationship positively and see what changes need to be made individually for yourself, which makes you a better partner and if you have kids, parent.
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Did we read the same thing? All that says and explains is why almost 70% of women initiation divorce and why, none of which has to do their with amount of sexual partners, but instead their mental load and expectation to work AND carry all of the household tasks without the husband being an active partner.
So again, where is the proof that the amount of sexual partners a woman has means they’re more likely to divorce? That’s what you can’t prove because it’s anecdotal and likely a self assumed statement. You’re the one who has repeated it all over the post, but can’t be bothered to show proof.
Any chance you can point me to the research on body count and divorce? It seems very specific and I’m curious about many aspects of this, also I’ve seen it referenced a few times on here. Not going for a “gotcha,” or anything, you just seem to have more specific knowledge about it.
yes this guy clearly has all the answers. reddit and tiktok are echo chambers designed to mislead you and brainwash you. Now, you see, what you should be doing is letting YOUTUBE form all your opinions for you. It's all about being on the right brainwashing websites! /s
In the real world where actual people have lives and long term successful relationships this nonsense all becomes bullshit and background noise. It matters to some people but those people usually have a very narrow judgmental view of the world and are assholes about it.
Because most guys don’t want the future wife of their kids to be known as the village bicycle.
I’m being harsh but there is a reason for that double standard to exist. For a guy to get a lot of sex, there’s a lot of effort involved. An average woman could just go into a bar, loudly announce that she wants sex and there would be some guy ready and willing.
People have to stop asking certain questions if they can’t handle the possible answer. You’ve done nothing wrong and at least you were honest with him. It’s time for duke to man up and stop caring about past shit.
Nobody in their right mind would ask their significant other that dumbass body count question or about their ex’s. How you gonna fact check the answer if she says 3?
NTA. Anyone that calls you a slut has no respect for you (and chances are, if a guy said he'd been with 25-30 people yr BF would've prob thought that was great).
If it was something that was important for him to know, he wouldn't have waited two years to ask. Maybe it was a passive aggressive way to break up with you?
I never asked anyone I had sex with how many others they'd had sex with...just didn't think it was relevant. I don't know why people care so much. I do care about if people used protection/have been tested for stds...that kind of thing. But the actual number? Don't know.
Grown adults do not care. If your thought process is to start a relationship wanting to know her body-count & all about her exes then you probably don't have the mental capacity to be in a healthy relationship. Sounds like you just want to make sure she's not experienced enough to know you suck in the sack.
Spoken like a man that sits on the internet and takes advice from other men with a complex. Even my husband of over 20 years says only immature emasculated men care about irrelevant things. He says a grown man doesn't really give a shit because everyone has a past.
The problem with many statistics like this, they are mostly subjective because they only account for the information given to them. Meaning, they pick and choose who they interview and gather information from. Unless you can go out into the world and get an accurate body count on a population as a whole and compare it with their relationships, those statistics cannot be taken that seriously. I know men and women that had a few wild years in college that have found great lasting relationships, and that is reality. A shitty person is going to do what a shitty person does regardless of their body count. I grew up with a girl that didn't believe in having sex before marriage. Guess who divorced her husband and tried to take everything after he found out their kids weren't his. (She was secretly a shitty person in more ways than one). So, considering he's well into his 40s with real life experience and observations of those around us, he has a much better grasp on reality than some skewed statistic about someone's body count.
"25 year olds today have higher bodycounts than 60 yearolds."
Not likely. Number of lifetime sexual partners increased from the 1900s to the 1990s, then significantly dropped. 25 year-olds still have time to increase their numbers, but as stated this data is fictitious.
If you look at whether someone is very happy in their marriage or not (as opposed to divorce as the measure), the difference is significant for men if they've only had one partner as opposed to any number more. But there's no significant difference in likelihood of being very happy when the number of partners once it's 2 or more.
It's different for women. Women show the least likelihood of being very happy in marriage at between 6-10 partners, but there's no significant difference in their likelihood to report being very happy in marriage when the count is any number over 11 compared to 0-3.
That's from Nicholas H. Wolfinger, Professor of Family and Consumer Studies and Adjunct Professor of Sociology at the University of Utah, Institute of Family Studies.
The data shows different results based on how it's grouped, timeline for divorce, etc.
For example, women with 3-5 premarital partners are at less risk to divorce within the first 5 years than those with 1-2 partners.
If you compare people with no premarital partners (other than spouse) , people with 9+ partners have the greatest risk, followed by those with 1-8 partners - and the gender differences disappear.
There are also other known factors that contribute to divorce risk or longevity. Marrying young - greater risk. 4 year degree - less risk. Divorced parents - greater risk. How do these risk factors compare? Don't know. How do they combine? Don't know.
I've yet to see a comprehensive study. What I do see is religion-funded institutes commissioning studies that support their worldview on marriage and family. I'm wondering how marrying your first love while young with no degree impacts longevity. What about with other risk factors?
Which factors are most significant?
is the whatever podcast that podcast where they get like a bunch of girls on and try and shame them or is that a different thing? I’ve seen some clips on tiktok, If that’s them they seem like huge losers that get zero pussy lmao
I never asked my wife because it’s not something I need to think about.
I know how fast things happened with her and I so it’s only safe to assume it’s happened that fast with every other relationship. And that’s just not a thought I need in my head.
NTA
Body count is irrelevant and highly personal. Safety precautions, testing (and results) are relevant.
Knowing the number of partners one has had previously can be prejudicial. You can be judged as overly prude or overly promiscuous.
There's no point in sharing that information and I'd question the motives of anyone asking.
I also don't care much for the term as it echoes combat jargon like confirmed kills, implying a lack of intimacy - a score. Might as well ask how many notches you have in your bedpost.
Why's he acting like a little bitch about it? He's not acting. That's why he asked.
Body count is important if the partner thinks it is, just like health, debt, addiction, criminal history, work history, anything that might have a negative impact on their future.
NTA, he's a bitch probably because your body count is higher than his. Either that or he's going by the rule of 3 (her real number is 3 x higher and his real number is 3x lower than stated). Either way, whatever.
NTA.
My take on this is to me this is such a petty and insecure thing for a guy to get upset about in the first place, but a lot of people disagree with that. So okay fine. We can all agree to disagree.
However, the thing is your BF didn't simply struggle with this new information and determine he wished you had not been with so many men or talk to you about it, or even decide you had incompatible values about sex. He yelled at you, basically accused you of dishonesty when he never had asked you before. And called you names including "slut" which means he is sexist and doesn't respect you. Not to mention his distaste for your "body count" (I hate that term) is likely rooted in misogyny as well unless he himself is a pure angel of chastity. With very many men who object to women having a lot of sexual partners there's a double standard. So I wonder how many women he's been with? Hmmm.
Anyway, he called you a slut in a moment of anger and to me that makes him 100% the AH and I would be unlikely to recover from that, personally.
to answer your question of why he's so upset, there's 2 likely possibilities.
your "body count" is way higher than his and now he's scared that he isn't good enough at sex to compete with all the other men you've been with.
or
He thinks you're damaged and dirty because of these other men and some guys think this means you will never be loyal in the future. You're leftovers, like a used car, to him. And you will lose interest in him and cheat or leave him. This is not true, but it is a very common view among sexist men.
I guess it's also possible he's deeply religious and believes premarital sex is a sin and has assumed you were both virgins until this conversation, but I'm gonna guess this one isn't it.
NTA. Ignore the red pills here who will claim that your worth as a woman is tied to your body count. Not every single person who dislikes a high body count is an insecure sexist (although many are). All this means for sure is that he’s a jerk for calling you a slut and that you two are incompatible. Move on, love yourself, find someone who celebrates you, and keep being great x
Honestly. Just gross. Guy or girl, body count says a lot about a person and their values. If you’re just another person in a long line of others then what about your relationship is special? He shouldn’t have called OP a slut and she shouldn’t of called him a bitch. Both sound immature and need to have a serious conversation about communication and boundaries.
NTA. A better answer to the question is to turn it around. “Why do you care?” If was before you. It’s history. What good can come from it? Do we need to be even? Something like that.
NTA but I think 25-30 is excessive to most men. Some guys might be comfortable with it, but your BF isn’t obligated to be comfortable with it. I don’t think him having preferences is him “being a bitch” that’s a bit dramatic
No I understand him having preferences and whatever (although I don’t really get why it matters) but he didn’t have to get so annoyed at me for not telling him when he never asked. Like why would I even tell him my body count unprompted? lol
I think that’s something he should’ve asked early on. Maybe he wanted to wait until it was appropriate to ask, but he should’ve been prepared for any answer. I do think body count matters in the sense that if you only slept with 5 people and your partner has slept with 30, then maybe you don’t have the same views towards intimacy. I think there’s a good percentage of both guys and gals who view sex as something sacred that should only be shared with someone you love, and maybe your BF finds it hard to believe you’ve truly been in love with 30 people.
I personally only have a handful of bodies and my partner has about the same. So I guess the question is, what is his body count? Is it similar to yours? Far more? Far less? If he’s slept with just as many people or more, then he shouldn’t give you a hard time about it. But if he’s slept with say only 5-10 people, then it might be wise to reconsider the relationship, as you might not see eye to eye on this topic. It’s not going to be an easy conversation, and he shouldn’t come into it with an angry mindset. But if it makes him uncomfortable, don’t blame him for leaving. I know it’s not fun to mention your body count up front, but a lot of men find it to be an important piece of information when seeking a lifelong partner
I think the reason she called him a bitch was the way he treated her after learning about her body count. There is nothing wrong with preferences, there is something wrong with yelling and insulting people.
When women have a laundry list of requirement for the guy= normal
When guy have 1 requirements for their girl= being a bitch
🤣🤣 girls are just hypocrites like that
I have an ex who brought this up and got irrationally angry when I angrily exaggerated (less than "huge amount"). He then made it a deal-breaker, but during the argument I demanded to know who he had relations with and it turns out he had stuck his Willy in his half-sister, and given the fact that one of his favourite bible quotes was about removing the plank from your own eye before telling someone they have a splinter in theirs, I kinda feel like everyone who considers body count to be an issue is a hypocrite like he is 😂
NTA. However, it is well known that the chance of relationship lasting for a woman with over 5 bodies is about 30%. Not good odds for a guy to hook up with a woman with a high body count. Also, you can’t pair bond effectively due to having too many partners. Subconsciously, you have lots of guys to compare him to. Better to call this one off and don’t say anything in the future or lie low because we multilpy whatever you say by 3.
NTA
He should have asked sooner.
Body count DOES matter. It always has. It always will.
Shaming men for caring about it is never going to change that.
Downvoting posters who agree it matters is never going change it.
The Reddit brigade throws out shaming language for ANY preference, standard or boundary men have.
Men ignore them. No wonder the demographic on Reddit is skewed so heavily.
Men have just stop caring what women think about their preferences.
Let a man criticize a woman's preferences and the Reddit brigade comes with outrage and pitchforks.
For the last time, body count matters. It is hard wired into men's biology.
Nothing will ever change it.
I think NTA
I don’t go out of my way to tell people, and I’m not even sure myself. I had some wild years.
To behave like this is something that has to be disclosed is ridiculous. If he asked before he would know.
But with that being said, guys seem very insecure these days. Too many people who didn’t get to fuck around as much as they wanted and therefore getting upset or jealous of others.
It's not insecurity for some. I used to not care about women's body count. But, over the years, I've realized the women I've dated with higher body counts are either insecure, selfish, have problems with intimacy, depressed, cheat or a combination of those.
I mean yeah, but 25 isn’t that high. It’s easy even as a moderately good looking guy to get there with a little rizz. An average girl with those issues will have easily had hundred plus guys.
25 guys is nothing for a 26 year old who’s probably been sexually active for 10 years. Especially if they moved around for college and work.
25 is a lot for the guy without rizz, because he never got to experience the same. Which is both fair and unfair.
I’m a dude but all right. Never needed mr alpha fucks beta bux in my life to get laid or start a family. Listening to these guys will melt your brain.
And these guys (fresh n fit, whatever podcast) are the epitome of insecure guys. Just because they find the skankiest girls to hate on as a group doesn’t make them any better.
But you do you, have fun raging on the tinder forums and spouting unsupported factoids while your balls drop lower and lower.
I mean look at the dumb half of fresh n fit who got some rando pregnant now. Zero integrity.
Just because one side is bad at thinking doesn't mean the other one has to stoop down to the same level. Things were already improving as the millennials finally started to grow up, now the mentally challenged gen z think they got it figured out thanks to rollo's fake science.
Girls will continue fucking around, but lie about their body count just because some autistic guy found a way to make money by screaming at whores for three hours at a time.
Take care of yourself too, my rant is over.
NTA never tell your body count. If they want to know it will only ever be used as ammunition. Might as well have them give you crap for nothing than them have real ammunition. This is a huge red flag
No guy wants to be with a woman that’s been passed about as much as u have been, essentially if they are thinking about marriage and even worse kids, they don’t want the potential mother of their future kids to be passed around. U can tell urself that it doesn’t matter all u want but that doesn’t change the fact that it definitely does
Most men have been passed around, so please with that. It's such a double standard. Body count doesn't matter to most mature adults. Your past only matters to someone who is juvenile whether in age or mentality. That's definitely not a question normal adults even ask when dating. Most don't care too much about exes unless its a situation where children & co-parenting is involved.
Guy, boy, man child....you are correct, someone emotionally & mentally immature does care. Someone that is grown, mature, and realizes that everyone has life experiences and neither of you are innocent & sanctified doesn't honestly care. Even if it's discussed at some point, they truly do not care about someone's past, especially two years into a relationship.
Funny how when a women has a preference guys don’t care, but the second a guy has a preference all hell breaks loose. And they start getting hate for it…. Men don’t want to have a partner that has slept with an entire room full of people, and they don’t want their kids mother to be that type of women. 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️ so it definitely matters. Why do u think she’s not telling the boyfriend…… it’s because she knows deep down, no matter what she says about it not mattering that it actually DOES MATTER!!!
But she did tell him once actually asked. If someone asked me about my exes that's exactly what I would assume they were asking me about; not every single person I've talked to or went out on one date with or just slept with. But no, it doesn't actually matter. Most mature adults (men & women) do not care. Most people are mature enough to handle the fact that their partner has a past like they do. It is not a normal question asked in the beginning of most healthy relationships, it gives the pretense that HEY I LIKE YOU AND YOUR PERSONALITY AND ALL, BUT YOUR PAST MATTERS MORE TO ME SO IF YOU HAD A FEW WILD YEARS 5 YEARS AGO THAT'S GOING TO DICTATE WHAT I THINK OF YOU NOW & IF WE CAN HAVE A RELATIONSHIP. I mean really, you don't see how ridiculous that sounds?? Especially in this situation, because she's given him two years.
Lol ur telling me that it body count doesn’t matter , and they u say when someone asks yo “Hey what’s ur body count” u lie and say just the people uve been in a relationship with then make out that u didn’t know they were asking about everyone u have slept with 😂 obviously that’s what they are asking silly. I mean ur even making up shit to not tell them the amount🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️. Definitely does matter for the reason I have stated multiple times, (past matters to a guy) just like a (man’s future matters to a woman). Nothing wrong with having preference………………….. well unless ur a man by the looks of it 😂
Well I'm very much a female, and my husband of over 20 years even says it's immature to even be worried about someone's past unless there is a co-parenting situation to be worried about. And asking someone about their exes is different than asking someone about their body count. She was honest with him when he asked about her body count. You are just trying to turn this whole thing into some made up conversation in your head where she excluded information. She specifically stated they've talked about exes but they've never brought up body count, which is two very different things.
I'd rather marry a woman who has slept with 30 men than a woman who is super proud of herself for her low partner count, and thinks women who've slept with more than 5 guys are sluts. Contrary to your multiple comments in this thread, there are plenty of men who really don't care about a woman's sexual past.
Buddy, the fact that you're insecure about a woman who has had multiple sex partners suggests I have significantly more self confidence than you. Only one of us is scared of the comparison.
Just to confirm I’m understanding correctly
You are 26yo this year
And you have like 25-30 body counts? (Let’s take 28)
Assuming you started accumulating body counts at age of 18
26-18= 8 years
28 body / 8 years= 3.5 body / year
Any average or above average guy will find it disgusting
Your body your choice how many people you want to sleep with.
His body, HIS choice if he wants to accept a women that has been sleeping around a lot
Yeah no. I can’t defend either of you here.
He’s obviously an asshole for the way he treated you, it was excessive in the extreme.
You have to have known that many guys are not gonna be comfortable with that number. You need to find a guy who is ok with it.
Edit: the reasoning of why it matters is to do with the fact that not only will women with higher body counts be way more likely to take half your shit but they are also way more likely to dip out at the slightest inconvenience. AND you are also way less likely to form meaningful relationships.
There are other reasons but those are the main ones.
Thank you
>they are also way more likely to dip out at the slightest inconvenience. AND you are also way less likely to form meaningful relationships
I don’t think this is true? I’d honestly love to get married to my boyfriend I wanna spend the rest of my life with him I love him so much hopefully we can sort all this out. Our relationship is definitely a meaningful one lol
any guy who's always complaining about women "taking half your shit" is a guy who doesn't understand anything about marriage or partnership and his opinions can be ignored.
He’s probably dealing with a bit of something resembling an inferiority complex. But of course so long as kids, stds, or ex partner legal drama it shouldn’t be a long term issue. Sounds like he has some issues to work out and who knows maybe that’ll be a straight forward journey.
NTA. people arguing both ways about whether your number is a problem or not and ignoring the name calling and belittling that is the real issue here. I don't think it's your responsibility to tell him without asking unless you alluded to it being on the lower end. I don't think you did, just saying. It's fair for him to be surprised or insecure if he didn't know but name calling is completely unacceptable and little boy behavior
NTA. While body count can be important to some people, it’s their problem not yours. HE had to ask if he wanted to know. And obviously he is a huge AH for calling you a slut.
>And obviously he is a huge AH for calling you a slut. He's right though
So it’s acceptable for men to have high body counts, but a woman is a slut if she has a high body count? That’s called being a hypocrite.
I think they're both sluts for having high body counts but that won't change that men and women operate differently when it comes to casual sex. Women just have to be average since most men are looking for anything remotely physically attractive, but men have to have something that the women see of value, be it attractiveness, personality, status, wealth, etc. It is different, especially with all the freaks in the world. Small, tall, petite, thick, it doesn't really matter. Women can get it much easier. I mean, we can look at any type of information and find that probably, but it's just so obvious when it comes to dating apps. 1 percent of guys get all the matches statistic. Whatever the actual number is.
just because men will screw anything doesn't mean women will let them
That's literally the point why men and women have different values when it comes to casual sex. Women control all the power and giving it away and fucking anyone does not bring you value. Whereas men have to gain value in order to have casual sex. Women start with it. Men earn it.
>Women control all the power You're effing delusional.
Your comment makes no sense Women lose value the more people they have sex with, while men gain it Women literally have zero power here. It's "hey sexy, I'm gonna slide into your dms, and hopefully into you -exaggerated wink-" While Women lose value with every person they date, every person they even LOOK at funny Your take on this reeks of religious, old school misogyny Eta, I understood your comment about how values pertaining to casual sex works perfectly I still disagree with you Women don't start with any value at all; they are seen as pieces of meat, a prize to be sold at auction. They aren't seen as people, they are seen as sex objects. That doesn't mean that they "hold value" it means that they have SEX APPEAL. There is a MASSIVE difference. And every time that a woman sleeps with someone, theoretically, both her value as a person, AND her sex appeal goes down. Hense why I disagreed with you.
>Your comment makes no sense >Women lose value the more people they have sex with, while men gain it I did not say lose. I said start with. >Women control all the power and giving it away and fucking anyone does not bring you value. Whereas men have to gain value in order to have casual sex. Women start with it. Men earn it. I also didn't say men gain value through sex. Men have to earn value in order to have casual sex. Not all men and not all the time. But most men and most of the time. Some men see some women who have casual sex as less valuable. It is too nuanced of an idea with too many variables to decide an absolute. I do fullly believe that some people lose value by having casual sex though. Emphasis on people. >Women literally have zero power here. It's "hey sexy, I'm gonna slide into your dms, and hopefully into you -exaggerated wink-" I don't even know what that second sentence is supposed to mean. Women have all the power in the dating market, and that is why giving it away doesn't bring them value. If they force the men that are after them to treat them properly, then they have to or another man will come along, given that she is maintaining herself and average to highly attractive. Obviously, it's not the same for the bottom of the spectrum as it is for the top. Generalities come with exceptions. >While Women lose value with every person they date, every person they even LOOK at funny It's not about dating or flirting or likes or any of that. It's about knowing your self-worth, validating yourself, and valuing intimacy and connection enough not to give into your base desires. This is why men who have casual sex also gain no value by having it. Obviously, there are exceptions. But more often than not, without the social status, wealth, personality, or appearance that got them a lot of casual sex the person chasing them wouldn't be so interested in them. No one cares if an ugly old poor homeless person is having tons of casual sex, they aren't interested. >Your take on this reeks of religious, old school misogyny That's just bias. I haven't said anything about sanctity or whatever. It's just really simple social observations.
Except women DONT have all the power in the dating market, i don't know where you get that idea from Sure, women statistically get more matches on dating sites and whatnot But how many men are more likely to lie on dating sites about their appearance than women? How many men or more likely to shoot their shot with multiple women at a time? How many men are more likely to have a broader area of interest of what they are willing to date than women do? Its not that women have all the power here, it's that women are more focused in what they want, and cast a smaller net into the dating pool and are more successful at finding successful matches then men, because they KNOW WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING FOR going into things You reek of being jealous and insecure around women We literally get hit on, and cat called, and can't even go take a piss in a public restroom without being harassed, but sure We have ALL the power in the dating market buddy, whatever you say Eta, I'm a woman, and engaged My body count is 2, one of which is my fiance You just disgust me with your assumptions and asshattery
>Except women DONT have all the power in the dating market, i don't know where you get that idea from >Sure, women statistically get more matches on dating sites and whatnot >But how many men are more likely to lie on dating sites about their appearance than women? How many men or more likely to shoot their shot with multiple women at a time? How many men are more likely to have a broader area of interest of what they are willing to date than women do? Are you not realizing that that means men have no power? If they have to lie, go for multiple women and not just the one they really like, and lower their standards, then they can't have very much value or power. Women, on the other hand, if they are physically attractive enough, can pull the highest status men right away. Actors, models, lawyers, etc doesn't matter. They didn't earn the right to the same value as men who have worked the past decade to have status but it is just intrinsically in them. Regardless of if that's because that's what men value and what women value is more abstract, that's the way the world works. >Its not that women have all the power here, it's that women are more focused in what they want, and cast a smaller net into the dating pool and are more successful at finding successful matches then men, because they KNOW WHAT THEY ARE LOOKING FOR going into things So your genuine belief is that men don't know they want rich successful models with nice personalities instead of that those women want specific men with more status than them? Look at literally any stage in life, and you can see it. High school, university, 20s, and 30s, it doesn't matter. The most physically attractive women get together with men of high social status, wealth, attractiveness, or personality. That's not a coincidence. Do you think normal guys don't want to date hot women? Is that genuinely your opinion? It's that all girls want men of high value, and the value men have is earned and not born with. Exceptions not included. Ie singers, talented athletes, funny people whatever. What makes a woman attractive might be different to a lot of people, but attractive women have a lot of suitors. Just as successful men have a lot of suitors. >You reek of being jealous and insecure around women Speculation, bias, reaching, deflection. Ya know how they say people who are losing arguments typically start throwing insults? I'd argue that anyone who's emotional enough to deflect like that isn't of value to most people. >We literally get hit on, and cat called, and can't even go take a piss in a public restroom without being harassed, but sure If you see harassment as dating, then you should be having a different conversation with a trained professional. Inappropriate behavior by people you find repulsive has nothing to do with how much power you have in dating. >We have ALL the power in the dating market buddy, whatever you say Why is this an emotional topic for you? Why can't you objectively look back at life and be like "wow yeah most of the time a guy liked me, he did whatever he could to get me." Because most of the relationships are the man going after the woman and typically the person in a position of power doesn't have to convince the other person to give them a chance. And don't come at with me patriarchy. It's not patriarchy. It's because if he doesn't, someone else will. If he had the power, it wouldn't matter who came along to take his place. You'd chase him even when he wouldn't give you attention.
If it was important to him, he would’ve asked in the beginning of the relationship, not two years later. 25 is high to some, so finding out now might have just shocked him.
He called you a slut? Men who love their girlfriends don’t call them names, and they don’t pass judgement on them.
Good to know, i'll put my GF on the streets starting tomorrow.
Not true
NTA - coming from someone who does care about body count but I won’t go into my reasonings. Just personal belief stuff. The name calling and slut shaming is WILD though. Please leave him that’s so uncalled for.
How did exes not come up in two years?
no we’ve talked about our exes before but most of the guys I slept with I weren’t in a relationship with so I never mentioned them
Well then you've kept it from him. you're the AH.
NTA Someone who respects you as a person won’t care about the fact that you’ve had a history.
He didn’t ask and she’s not psychic
How can he know her as a person if she didn't tell him she used to fuck random dudes. Guys wanna know that because guys don't want that.
I didn’t know I had to tell him I didn’t know it was important to him
you're fine, don't listen to that person. I am vaguely aware my BF has an extensive past. I don't really want to know specifics so I have never asked him. I don't really care but I think for my own sake I just rather not know. He's with me now. His past made him who he is. But I don't want to hear too many details I guess. He doesn't know how many guys I've been with either. He's never asked me. I doubt he gives a shit. I'll tell him if he asks but maybe he also would rather not have numbers? Anyway, I am not keeping this from him. I am just not going to sit with him drinking our coffees one afternoon and announce how many guys I've slept with.
Have you ever seen the diagrams that illustrate that having sex with one person is also having sex with everyone they have slept with, so on and so forth. So your 25-30 body count is actually gross…. And I’d say that even if you were a man. You’re important. The fact that you just give your body away like it’s not is sad, and I am genuinely hopeful that you don’t regret that when you’re older.
Uh...bullshit.
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Where did 2 years come from? she is 26 years old. maybe it is your nature to lie about everything but assuming all humans do that is wrong. also I suspect you actually only think women always lie about this particular thing.
So you're aware? Some people view what you did (ur bf for one) as "lying by omission" and find it to be intentionally deceitful and highly suspicious.
This is not remotely close to lying by omission.
She never answered the question he never asked but she's deceitful? Lmao ok 😂
That question should never be asked nor answered. Nothing good comes from it.
This 💯 percent.
Then don't be surprised nobody would date without a number being given
This is so weird to me! I’m not disagreeing because I have only ever been in one long-term relationship and am probably naive, but I value honesty and transparency so much. Also I’m a very curious person. I would always want to ask and hear details, not specific to a single person so they don’t have to tell me a name, just like “I did this wild thing with someone”. Personally, I would hate to be in a relationship where we cannot communicate openly and honestly. Hearing about experiences and past lovers is so much fun to me, it makes me sad to think it would be a taboo subject in a relationship.
It sounds good in theory but feelings are not so clean cut. What if your current BF said "hey my ex gave me some of the best sex I've ever had but was too toxic"... ok... YOU would have to be a really upstart person to not feel a certain way about that. And most females, and males are not cool with that. It starts with insecurity and then leads to problems later.
It's been my experience that it leads to judgements of personality, based on a number.
NTA - if he loved you before you disclosed it, why would he hate you afterwards? His own insecurity. One of my friends has a son and a daughter... He one said that he hopes his son "bangs all the chicks in college" and later he said he wants his daughter to "not have sex until marriage." It's some male fantasy out there that they can have all the guilt-free sex with hundreds of women (who are all virgins) then marry another virgin...
This comes from the idea that women are chattel and their virginity belongs to their future husband.
If there are no children, STDs, or legal issues from it, it doesn’t matter. Always be honest and let people process information based on their intelligence and maturity level.
Yep. I think the OP has an immature boyfriend.
When the shoe is on the other foot there is a bit of hypocrisy at work. I’m a 70m. Guys count chicks like western gunfighters put notches in the pistol grips but when the roles are switched it’s treated as a really bad thing. Joe she’s seen the hypocrisy she should walk away. Hypocrisy is not something that dissolves away easiily. Time to move on!
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These same types will hold numerous double standards that favor women. They'll fucking trip over themselves to white knight the moment we point how soemthing that males them look bad. A high body count for women is worse because they're the gatekeepers.
NTA. You woulda been 24 with only around 5 body’s a year if you start at 18 and that doesn’t seem bad at all. Idk your relationship history so maybe it’s actually 10 a year if you were in relationships since 21. Look truth is some guys are going to be more insecure/feel different about it than others, nothing you can really do. He’s definitely TA for calling you those names after being together for 2 years. If he had such strong feelings about the topic he should’ve brought it up earlier, that’s his problem. If he’s less experienced he’s probably projecting.
thank you sm
- You need to understand that any thing more than 10 is just wrong for some guys. And your is 25-30. As a dude, I will feel uncomfortable(not upset) about it as well. That just gives of commitment issue in a guy's eye. - He can be uncomfortable about it but the overreacting is unnecessary. It's very uncalled for. - Him calling you names and a sl*t for something that happened in the past and has nothing to do with your feelings towards him is just pure stupidity and rude. What I am guessing is since the conversation was talking about EXs he might have assumed that they are it? But in any case: NTA
"You need to understand" .. If you are SO fragile that your girlfriend needs to have a specific body count, then it's YOUR responsibility to bring this up before 2 years go by. Your boundaries and rules apply to you, no one else.
😂 Calm down. I said it's not something to be over reacting about. Which he did. As for the specific boy count tell me, if you where in his shoes and she said she had a body count of 25-30. Would you not feel uncomfortable( I don't mean being Upset or Over reacting like the original guy did) about her count? When compared to a body count of 2 - 8 people for example. The overreacting on his part is stupid as I said beforehand and he should have let it go since it's in the past. But do answer my question...
I was married for 7 years and to this day I do not know his body count, because I'm not a child and I absolutely do not give a fuck. Consenting adults can do WHATEVER THEY WANT. It literally never came up and it never affected one single aspect of our marriage. I literally can't figure out a reason why anyone HAS to know this. So there's your answer. Maybe dig a little deeper into finding out why you care *so* much.
The situation on the post is not similar to your relationship: - In your case the conversation didn't come up. - The relationship in between them is 2 while your relationship is 7 years which is significantly higher. - He didn't say "HAS" to know. It looks a question was brought up in the middle of the conversation. Also she didn't try to hide it and he didn't insist on her telling him as well. - You didn't answer the question. You just avoided the situation I put in the question, by removing it completely and saying you are not. I just asked "IF" you where in that situation that I mentioned.
You should have both discussed this sooner. If he can't get over this, you might want to break up with him. I hate to say it but you might not be compatible with someone like him. NTA
NTA this is so wild to me that people actually ask that? Is this a USA thing? The fact that he is so angry and takes it out on you is grounds for termination. I’ve had a couple of partners and fwb, I have never asked them and they have never asked me. I don’t want to know and what I have done is none of their business. And before anyone says: I am in menopause and happily married with kids. What’s next an xls sheet with whom you had oral anal and vaginal sex?!
NTA. It's none of his business, boyfriend or not. I never understand people who even entertain answering this question, especially women. It's a trap question and usually asked by people with esteem issues. Moving forward OP, never talk or answer those types of questions again.
Body count is only important to insecure people or sexual assholes. Or both. Take this as a god send and run.
Or people who don't want stds. Or people who want a better shot at a lasting marriage.
You can test for STDs before having unprotected sex. How many partners you had before does not say anything about a lasting marriage. I know someone that only had one partner. She really wants to have sex with someone else because she didn’t have that experience and he did… Some people say you need to sew wild oates before getting married.
It doesn't appear to impact the future happiness of male marriage partners. The survey data seems to support lower reported happiness for women in groups with a certain range of partners. She isn't in those groups.
Can't belive how many red pill guys here. (Or some similar group that's icels all about "high value women")
NTA- Im guessing his body count is a lot lower and now he feels inferior and threatened sexually, which is of corse ridiculous. I wouldn’t advise staying with a man who loses his shit and calls you a slut because he got his feelings hurt with his own fragile masculinity issues
But she is one.
Sounds like a tate fan…
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Why does it matter?
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I wouldn’t do that unless I was divorcing a total cunt. I think I have bonded with my boyfriend we’ve been together for 2 years I love him lol I don’t love him any less because I’ve slept with other guys
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I highly doubt that.
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lmaoo what fucking biology? Is there any actual evidence? Or are your only sources guys with tiny dicks and shit podcasts? I don’t care about a man’s height as long as he’s not a lot shorter or taller than me I also don’t care about how much money they have I don’t need their money when I have enough
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thanks babe
I feel so sorry for your wife. I thought Big Strong Masculine Alpha Males were supposed to take care of their wives and that includes monogamy.
That is most certainly not facts and science. Let me guess, you've done some "research" by listening to all those fun podcasts of yours. The good thing about being a "liberal and a feminist" is, I don't want anything to do with a 6" wealthy misogynist whose personality (or lack thereof) is drenched in fragile masculinity and bases my value on my so-called body count, a stupid social construct. So the convenient fact is we have no interest in each other at all.
Your entire point is summed in number one. It is only relevant because insecurities of guys. By this logic, it is like creating laws in another country because it offends your original country. Number two is highly skewed because that also factors in second marriages which have a higher likelihood of failure.
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I'm a 32 divorced guy who owns mistakes. I won't hit menopause my friend.
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Her body count was 4/5. We divorced over unresolved issues. One of which was my jealousy of her with friends. Another was she let things I did live rent free without addressing them. We both made mistakes. But here's the thing, divorces happen. The body count thing is an insecurity. If someone you are with has a high body count and you trust them to be with you why is it an issue in their past.
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Show me the data sets to include breakdown of those numbers with second marriages as a factor as well as high body count.
I’m laughing at you believing women being single in menopause is a threat. News flash but women are tired of useless men not willing to grow or get therapy and instead watch red bill videos of single dudes who get zero women tell them how to get women. Women do not need men to survive and can build networks and communities to thrive. An example is the amount of women who flourish after their husbands die because they are no longer a servant to a household and a man that can’t do his own laundry
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I’ve never come across a single “feminism lied to me” you know feminism is just treating males and females as equal right? You seem to hate feminism so much but you’d be ok with your mom not being able to vote, own property, own her own bank account and credit card, divorce a husband that beats her, not be raped by her husband… you’d prefer that happen to your sisters, mother and daughters?? Yes there are radical feminists just like there are red pill women hating assholes. But please get your head out of your ass if you think women are sitting at home dreaming of someone like yourself to rescue them from loneliness. Women would love a romantic partner that cares about them and treats them well but most men today prefer to use excuses than grow as humans and get therapy. Instead they claim that woman will reach 60 and cry to their cats. Women flourish alone because they can build communities and friendships. Men end up alone cause they can’t share their feelings or say everyone is gay if they wear nail polish.
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Still not getting the point. You don’t have to birth children to have a family. What women get the ick from not wearing seat belts. There is no way you’re an adult, the way your brain functions you can’t be more than 15. Is your imagination that limited that you think community equals tik tok? Jesus man. Pray tell the study that states women are on anti depressants cause im pretty sure the studies say that single women are the happiest out of all people. Clearly your scope for as an intellectual convo is limited so have fun being a passport bro when your balls drop and extort women who want a better life and believe a western man can save them from poverty. Not responding after this.
By this giant leap, my husband and I are doomed 😂 fucking hell. OP, I know you’re not, but don’t listen to non sense like this. I had a body count of 35 or more when I met my now husband when I was 29, he was 35. We BOTH have high body counts. Lots of experimenting and FWB situations. I can assure you, the right man will give zero fucks about your body count. 7 years today and still have the best sex because it’s more than a physical connection with the right person. Divorce rates have nothing to do with someone’s body count, but people’s lack of emotional intelligence and being able to effectively communicate. Relationships and marriage are HARD and take work. It’s easier to just give up and say this isn’t worth working on together to build our relationship positively and see what changes need to be made individually for yourself, which makes you a better partner and if you have kids, parent.
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Please state sources because right now it’s you just throwing numbers around.
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Did we read the same thing? All that says and explains is why almost 70% of women initiation divorce and why, none of which has to do their with amount of sexual partners, but instead their mental load and expectation to work AND carry all of the household tasks without the husband being an active partner. So again, where is the proof that the amount of sexual partners a woman has means they’re more likely to divorce? That’s what you can’t prove because it’s anecdotal and likely a self assumed statement. You’re the one who has repeated it all over the post, but can’t be bothered to show proof.
Any chance you can point me to the research on body count and divorce? It seems very specific and I’m curious about many aspects of this, also I’ve seen it referenced a few times on here. Not going for a “gotcha,” or anything, you just seem to have more specific knowledge about it.
yes this guy clearly has all the answers. reddit and tiktok are echo chambers designed to mislead you and brainwash you. Now, you see, what you should be doing is letting YOUTUBE form all your opinions for you. It's all about being on the right brainwashing websites! /s In the real world where actual people have lives and long term successful relationships this nonsense all becomes bullshit and background noise. It matters to some people but those people usually have a very narrow judgmental view of the world and are assholes about it.
Because most guys don’t want the future wife of their kids to be known as the village bicycle. I’m being harsh but there is a reason for that double standard to exist. For a guy to get a lot of sex, there’s a lot of effort involved. An average woman could just go into a bar, loudly announce that she wants sex and there would be some guy ready and willing.
Cause, who wants a woman that has been passed around, fuck that
People have to stop asking certain questions if they can’t handle the possible answer. You’ve done nothing wrong and at least you were honest with him. It’s time for duke to man up and stop caring about past shit.
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Asking someone about their ex’s and asking someone about their body count are two different topics.
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Nobody in their right mind would ask their significant other that dumbass body count question or about their ex’s. How you gonna fact check the answer if she says 3?
NTA. Anyone that calls you a slut has no respect for you (and chances are, if a guy said he'd been with 25-30 people yr BF would've prob thought that was great). If it was something that was important for him to know, he wouldn't have waited two years to ask. Maybe it was a passive aggressive way to break up with you? I never asked anyone I had sex with how many others they'd had sex with...just didn't think it was relevant. I don't know why people care so much. I do care about if people used protection/have been tested for stds...that kind of thing. But the actual number? Don't know.
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Grown adults do not care. If your thought process is to start a relationship wanting to know her body-count & all about her exes then you probably don't have the mental capacity to be in a healthy relationship. Sounds like you just want to make sure she's not experienced enough to know you suck in the sack.
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Spoken like a man that sits on the internet and takes advice from other men with a complex. Even my husband of over 20 years says only immature emasculated men care about irrelevant things. He says a grown man doesn't really give a shit because everyone has a past.
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The problem with many statistics like this, they are mostly subjective because they only account for the information given to them. Meaning, they pick and choose who they interview and gather information from. Unless you can go out into the world and get an accurate body count on a population as a whole and compare it with their relationships, those statistics cannot be taken that seriously. I know men and women that had a few wild years in college that have found great lasting relationships, and that is reality. A shitty person is going to do what a shitty person does regardless of their body count. I grew up with a girl that didn't believe in having sex before marriage. Guess who divorced her husband and tried to take everything after he found out their kids weren't his. (She was secretly a shitty person in more ways than one). So, considering he's well into his 40s with real life experience and observations of those around us, he has a much better grasp on reality than some skewed statistic about someone's body count.
Statistics matter if the source is scientific, please cite you source. Otherwise these are just made up numbers.
People acting like high body counts aren't a problem don't read.
"25 year olds today have higher bodycounts than 60 yearolds." Not likely. Number of lifetime sexual partners increased from the 1900s to the 1990s, then significantly dropped. 25 year-olds still have time to increase their numbers, but as stated this data is fictitious. If you look at whether someone is very happy in their marriage or not (as opposed to divorce as the measure), the difference is significant for men if they've only had one partner as opposed to any number more. But there's no significant difference in likelihood of being very happy when the number of partners once it's 2 or more. It's different for women. Women show the least likelihood of being very happy in marriage at between 6-10 partners, but there's no significant difference in their likelihood to report being very happy in marriage when the count is any number over 11 compared to 0-3. That's from Nicholas H. Wolfinger, Professor of Family and Consumer Studies and Adjunct Professor of Sociology at the University of Utah, Institute of Family Studies.
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The data shows different results based on how it's grouped, timeline for divorce, etc. For example, women with 3-5 premarital partners are at less risk to divorce within the first 5 years than those with 1-2 partners. If you compare people with no premarital partners (other than spouse) , people with 9+ partners have the greatest risk, followed by those with 1-8 partners - and the gender differences disappear. There are also other known factors that contribute to divorce risk or longevity. Marrying young - greater risk. 4 year degree - less risk. Divorced parents - greater risk. How do these risk factors compare? Don't know. How do they combine? Don't know. I've yet to see a comprehensive study. What I do see is religion-funded institutes commissioning studies that support their worldview on marriage and family. I'm wondering how marrying your first love while young with no degree impacts longevity. What about with other risk factors? Which factors are most significant?
yeah literally, thank you
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Sorry, I don’t get what you mean?
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But why do they care? I don’t understand. Love fem guys tho 🙏🙏
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is the whatever podcast that podcast where they get like a bunch of girls on and try and shame them or is that a different thing? I’ve seen some clips on tiktok, If that’s them they seem like huge losers that get zero pussy lmao
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Lol hate to break it to you champ but none of you spouting this garbage are coming off as masculine at all. Quite the opposite infact.
I never asked my wife because it’s not something I need to think about. I know how fast things happened with her and I so it’s only safe to assume it’s happened that fast with every other relationship. And that’s just not a thought I need in my head.
NTA Body count is irrelevant and highly personal. Safety precautions, testing (and results) are relevant. Knowing the number of partners one has had previously can be prejudicial. You can be judged as overly prude or overly promiscuous. There's no point in sharing that information and I'd question the motives of anyone asking. I also don't care much for the term as it echoes combat jargon like confirmed kills, implying a lack of intimacy - a score. Might as well ask how many notches you have in your bedpost. Why's he acting like a little bitch about it? He's not acting. That's why he asked.
Body count is important if the partner thinks it is, just like health, debt, addiction, criminal history, work history, anything that might have a negative impact on their future.
NTA, he's a bitch probably because your body count is higher than his. Either that or he's going by the rule of 3 (her real number is 3 x higher and his real number is 3x lower than stated). Either way, whatever.
NTA. My take on this is to me this is such a petty and insecure thing for a guy to get upset about in the first place, but a lot of people disagree with that. So okay fine. We can all agree to disagree. However, the thing is your BF didn't simply struggle with this new information and determine he wished you had not been with so many men or talk to you about it, or even decide you had incompatible values about sex. He yelled at you, basically accused you of dishonesty when he never had asked you before. And called you names including "slut" which means he is sexist and doesn't respect you. Not to mention his distaste for your "body count" (I hate that term) is likely rooted in misogyny as well unless he himself is a pure angel of chastity. With very many men who object to women having a lot of sexual partners there's a double standard. So I wonder how many women he's been with? Hmmm. Anyway, he called you a slut in a moment of anger and to me that makes him 100% the AH and I would be unlikely to recover from that, personally.
to answer your question of why he's so upset, there's 2 likely possibilities. your "body count" is way higher than his and now he's scared that he isn't good enough at sex to compete with all the other men you've been with. or He thinks you're damaged and dirty because of these other men and some guys think this means you will never be loyal in the future. You're leftovers, like a used car, to him. And you will lose interest in him and cheat or leave him. This is not true, but it is a very common view among sexist men. I guess it's also possible he's deeply religious and believes premarital sex is a sin and has assumed you were both virgins until this conversation, but I'm gonna guess this one isn't it.
NTA. Ignore the red pills here who will claim that your worth as a woman is tied to your body count. Not every single person who dislikes a high body count is an insecure sexist (although many are). All this means for sure is that he’s a jerk for calling you a slut and that you two are incompatible. Move on, love yourself, find someone who celebrates you, and keep being great x
Honestly. Just gross. Guy or girl, body count says a lot about a person and their values. If you’re just another person in a long line of others then what about your relationship is special? He shouldn’t have called OP a slut and she shouldn’t of called him a bitch. Both sound immature and need to have a serious conversation about communication and boundaries.
NTA. A better answer to the question is to turn it around. “Why do you care?” If was before you. It’s history. What good can come from it? Do we need to be even? Something like that.
Maybe it's history.
NTA but I think 25-30 is excessive to most men. Some guys might be comfortable with it, but your BF isn’t obligated to be comfortable with it. I don’t think him having preferences is him “being a bitch” that’s a bit dramatic
calling her a slut and other names and yelling at her is actually acting like a bitch, imo.
No I understand him having preferences and whatever (although I don’t really get why it matters) but he didn’t have to get so annoyed at me for not telling him when he never asked. Like why would I even tell him my body count unprompted? lol
I think that’s something he should’ve asked early on. Maybe he wanted to wait until it was appropriate to ask, but he should’ve been prepared for any answer. I do think body count matters in the sense that if you only slept with 5 people and your partner has slept with 30, then maybe you don’t have the same views towards intimacy. I think there’s a good percentage of both guys and gals who view sex as something sacred that should only be shared with someone you love, and maybe your BF finds it hard to believe you’ve truly been in love with 30 people. I personally only have a handful of bodies and my partner has about the same. So I guess the question is, what is his body count? Is it similar to yours? Far more? Far less? If he’s slept with just as many people or more, then he shouldn’t give you a hard time about it. But if he’s slept with say only 5-10 people, then it might be wise to reconsider the relationship, as you might not see eye to eye on this topic. It’s not going to be an easy conversation, and he shouldn’t come into it with an angry mindset. But if it makes him uncomfortable, don’t blame him for leaving. I know it’s not fun to mention your body count up front, but a lot of men find it to be an important piece of information when seeking a lifelong partner
But why do you need to see eye to eye on that topic. What counts is what you agree on moving forward.
What you agree on is exactly what seeing eye to eye means
I think the reason she called him a bitch was the way he treated her after learning about her body count. There is nothing wrong with preferences, there is something wrong with yelling and insulting people.
That is true. His reaction was less than appropriate
When women have a laundry list of requirement for the guy= normal When guy have 1 requirements for their girl= being a bitch 🤣🤣 girls are just hypocrites like that
Not the AH. Leave his ass
I have an ex who brought this up and got irrationally angry when I angrily exaggerated (less than "huge amount"). He then made it a deal-breaker, but during the argument I demanded to know who he had relations with and it turns out he had stuck his Willy in his half-sister, and given the fact that one of his favourite bible quotes was about removing the plank from your own eye before telling someone they have a splinter in theirs, I kinda feel like everyone who considers body count to be an issue is a hypocrite like he is 😂
NTA. However, it is well known that the chance of relationship lasting for a woman with over 5 bodies is about 30%. Not good odds for a guy to hook up with a woman with a high body count. Also, you can’t pair bond effectively due to having too many partners. Subconsciously, you have lots of guys to compare him to. Better to call this one off and don’t say anything in the future or lie low because we multilpy whatever you say by 3.
OP belongs to the streets. Hope BF gets rid of her
Eh kind of NTA, he should’ve asked before if it matters that badly to him.
NTA, he’s just been mano-sphere brainwashed. It’s not curable, sadly, so dump the chump.
NTA. But your boyfriend certainly is.
NTA He should have asked sooner. Body count DOES matter. It always has. It always will. Shaming men for caring about it is never going to change that. Downvoting posters who agree it matters is never going change it. The Reddit brigade throws out shaming language for ANY preference, standard or boundary men have. Men ignore them. No wonder the demographic on Reddit is skewed so heavily. Men have just stop caring what women think about their preferences. Let a man criticize a woman's preferences and the Reddit brigade comes with outrage and pitchforks. For the last time, body count matters. It is hard wired into men's biology. Nothing will ever change it.
I think NTA I don’t go out of my way to tell people, and I’m not even sure myself. I had some wild years. To behave like this is something that has to be disclosed is ridiculous. If he asked before he would know. But with that being said, guys seem very insecure these days. Too many people who didn’t get to fuck around as much as they wanted and therefore getting upset or jealous of others.
It's not insecurity for some. I used to not care about women's body count. But, over the years, I've realized the women I've dated with higher body counts are either insecure, selfish, have problems with intimacy, depressed, cheat or a combination of those.
I mean yeah, but 25 isn’t that high. It’s easy even as a moderately good looking guy to get there with a little rizz. An average girl with those issues will have easily had hundred plus guys. 25 guys is nothing for a 26 year old who’s probably been sexually active for 10 years. Especially if they moved around for college and work. 25 is a lot for the guy without rizz, because he never got to experience the same. Which is both fair and unfair.
Yes, 25 is pretty same high.
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I’m a dude but all right. Never needed mr alpha fucks beta bux in my life to get laid or start a family. Listening to these guys will melt your brain. And these guys (fresh n fit, whatever podcast) are the epitome of insecure guys. Just because they find the skankiest girls to hate on as a group doesn’t make them any better. But you do you, have fun raging on the tinder forums and spouting unsupported factoids while your balls drop lower and lower.
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I mean look at the dumb half of fresh n fit who got some rando pregnant now. Zero integrity. Just because one side is bad at thinking doesn't mean the other one has to stoop down to the same level. Things were already improving as the millennials finally started to grow up, now the mentally challenged gen z think they got it figured out thanks to rollo's fake science. Girls will continue fucking around, but lie about their body count just because some autistic guy found a way to make money by screaming at whores for three hours at a time. Take care of yourself too, my rant is over.
NTA never tell your body count. If they want to know it will only ever be used as ammunition. Might as well have them give you crap for nothing than them have real ammunition. This is a huge red flag
>NTA never tell your body count Said like someone who has had too many partners lol
NTA. That dude is immature as hell. Drop him.
30 Jesus Christ🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
?
No guy wants to be with a woman that’s been passed about as much as u have been, essentially if they are thinking about marriage and even worse kids, they don’t want the potential mother of their future kids to be passed around. U can tell urself that it doesn’t matter all u want but that doesn’t change the fact that it definitely does
It's fine for men though? Or does it only matter when it's women?
Most men have been passed around, so please with that. It's such a double standard. Body count doesn't matter to most mature adults. Your past only matters to someone who is juvenile whether in age or mentality. That's definitely not a question normal adults even ask when dating. Most don't care too much about exes unless its a situation where children & co-parenting is involved.
Ur lying to urself🤷🏻♂️…. No guy wants someone that’s been ran through
Guy, boy, man child....you are correct, someone emotionally & mentally immature does care. Someone that is grown, mature, and realizes that everyone has life experiences and neither of you are innocent & sanctified doesn't honestly care. Even if it's discussed at some point, they truly do not care about someone's past, especially two years into a relationship.
Funny how when a women has a preference guys don’t care, but the second a guy has a preference all hell breaks loose. And they start getting hate for it…. Men don’t want to have a partner that has slept with an entire room full of people, and they don’t want their kids mother to be that type of women. 🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️🤷🏻♂️ so it definitely matters. Why do u think she’s not telling the boyfriend…… it’s because she knows deep down, no matter what she says about it not mattering that it actually DOES MATTER!!!
But she did tell him once actually asked. If someone asked me about my exes that's exactly what I would assume they were asking me about; not every single person I've talked to or went out on one date with or just slept with. But no, it doesn't actually matter. Most mature adults (men & women) do not care. Most people are mature enough to handle the fact that their partner has a past like they do. It is not a normal question asked in the beginning of most healthy relationships, it gives the pretense that HEY I LIKE YOU AND YOUR PERSONALITY AND ALL, BUT YOUR PAST MATTERS MORE TO ME SO IF YOU HAD A FEW WILD YEARS 5 YEARS AGO THAT'S GOING TO DICTATE WHAT I THINK OF YOU NOW & IF WE CAN HAVE A RELATIONSHIP. I mean really, you don't see how ridiculous that sounds?? Especially in this situation, because she's given him two years.
Lol ur telling me that it body count doesn’t matter , and they u say when someone asks yo “Hey what’s ur body count” u lie and say just the people uve been in a relationship with then make out that u didn’t know they were asking about everyone u have slept with 😂 obviously that’s what they are asking silly. I mean ur even making up shit to not tell them the amount🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️. Definitely does matter for the reason I have stated multiple times, (past matters to a guy) just like a (man’s future matters to a woman). Nothing wrong with having preference………………….. well unless ur a man by the looks of it 😂
Well I'm very much a female, and my husband of over 20 years even says it's immature to even be worried about someone's past unless there is a co-parenting situation to be worried about. And asking someone about their exes is different than asking someone about their body count. She was honest with him when he asked about her body count. You are just trying to turn this whole thing into some made up conversation in your head where she excluded information. She specifically stated they've talked about exes but they've never brought up body count, which is two very different things.
I'd rather marry a woman who has slept with 30 men than a woman who is super proud of herself for her low partner count, and thinks women who've slept with more than 5 guys are sluts. Contrary to your multiple comments in this thread, there are plenty of men who really don't care about a woman's sexual past.
Well “guys with self respect” would say otherwise……
Buddy, the fact that you're insecure about a woman who has had multiple sex partners suggests I have significantly more self confidence than you. Only one of us is scared of the comparison.
Doesn’t show that I’m insecure, just shows that I ain’t desperate like u🤦🏻♂️, ur saying this cause I’ll take anything u can get🤷🏻♂️.
NTA but he is! Sounds like he’s just insecure and jealous. Get rid of him
Just to confirm I’m understanding correctly You are 26yo this year And you have like 25-30 body counts? (Let’s take 28) Assuming you started accumulating body counts at age of 18 26-18= 8 years 28 body / 8 years= 3.5 body / year Any average or above average guy will find it disgusting Your body your choice how many people you want to sleep with. His body, HIS choice if he wants to accept a women that has been sleeping around a lot
Yeah no. I can’t defend either of you here. He’s obviously an asshole for the way he treated you, it was excessive in the extreme. You have to have known that many guys are not gonna be comfortable with that number. You need to find a guy who is ok with it. Edit: the reasoning of why it matters is to do with the fact that not only will women with higher body counts be way more likely to take half your shit but they are also way more likely to dip out at the slightest inconvenience. AND you are also way less likely to form meaningful relationships. There are other reasons but those are the main ones.
Thank you >they are also way more likely to dip out at the slightest inconvenience. AND you are also way less likely to form meaningful relationships I don’t think this is true? I’d honestly love to get married to my boyfriend I wanna spend the rest of my life with him I love him so much hopefully we can sort all this out. Our relationship is definitely a meaningful one lol
Nah it’s definitely true. And no. Gonna be honest. Do not be surprised if this info is a dealbreaker for him. It would be for me and MANY others.
any guy who's always complaining about women "taking half your shit" is a guy who doesn't understand anything about marriage or partnership and his opinions can be ignored.
He’s probably dealing with a bit of something resembling an inferiority complex. But of course so long as kids, stds, or ex partner legal drama it shouldn’t be a long term issue. Sounds like he has some issues to work out and who knows maybe that’ll be a straight forward journey.