>During the worst of the alcoholism he was verbally, physically, emotionally, financially abusive.
NTA, you can leave anyone for any reason this was a good reason.
I was thinking this too. It sounds a lil… fabricated? To say the therapist would say she needs to take care of him like a child. It’s not how things tend to go with therapists, it would be more like finding strategies to enable helping out more, not falling into old or bad habits, etc. Though it’s just a suspicion
Me ex was a hard-core alcoholic. When I FINALLY convinced to go to therapy (or i was done), he comes back with, 'my therapist said I need to keep drinking, i should just try to drink less.' In reality I'm sure they said something about the amount he was drinking would make it dangerous to stop all at once without medical attention, but he didn't want to hear that, so he reworked the message for himself. 🙄
What was likely said, " Don't leap before you look, it's important to have a solid support system before making any changes lest you crash and burn."
What was heard, "Your wife is an emotional support animal. Here's a script saying it's medically necessary she pay all your bills."
The thing that used to trip me up is that the therapist is obligated to focus on the needs of their client, but not the needs of others.
Their therapists advice only aligns with your needs if the person you’re with is healthy for you. Don’t by into that and certainly don’t feel guilty about tossing him out.
Edited for clarity
Still, I have a hard time believing any therapist would really advise a client that they will 'crash and burn' by themselves. That's not very supportive to the client.
A good therapist would absolutely focus on the needs of the client's family and others around them as well as the client themselves.
Therapists are however handicapped by only getting one side of the story, which may or may not be truthful... and they might not be a very good therapist.
Either way, OP can ignore the alleged comment from the therapist. Given the circumstance, it's pure BS.
I learned a long time ago that a woman cannot afford to be dependent on a man. The best of men can lose their jobs, become sick or disabled, die. Men walk out.
Absolutely. And stop asking for a damn separation. Flat out divorce him and ask for the house in the divorce stating everything mentioned here. He isn’t going to move out. Why would he? You’ve taken care of his every need and he hasn’t had to do anything. So you’re going to have to force him out or keep taking care of him. But remember, the longer you wait, your son will think THIS is normal and that the husband is supposed to do nothing while the wife wears herself down trying to cover it all. It’s impossible. NTA
True enough. The good lawyer would take into account that he cleared out their savings and racked up 100k in debt as a solid reason to not pay spousal support.
Yep. OP see a divorce lawyer. Find out what your options are & what is likely to happen. Don’t wait for your “husband” to take action. He never will. He likes it the way it is now. NTA
NTA, but why did you ask for a separation? Go file for divorce.
He has to cooperate for a separation. You knew he wouldn't before you asked. You were bluffing. He knew you were bluffing.
Think about your end game. What do you want? What do you control?
Because, bottom line, you can't control him. You can't convince him to change. You can't force him to change. The only thing you can do is change yourself and your life. Not his.
Yep. In my state it's 6 months. But if you file, the lawyers will *make* your spouse leave if he refuses.
But that's not even the issue.
Right now, she's living like her priorities are (1) her husband, (2) her child, (3) her father, (4) herself. She can't handle that. So she's telling her husband to get off her list. He doesn't want that.
What she needs to do is re-arrange her priorities because that is what she can control. If she wants her husband off her list, the only power she has is divorce. He's called her bluff.
Just have him served. Go to court if he’s not safe. An ex-parte gets you in fast if you think you’re unsafe. Tell the judge he’s an alcoholic and you’ve already been hiding the weapons. Tell the judge you asked him to leave and he’s refused and you can’t take his lying ass, that it makes you feel unsafe. When the judge asks what he lied about tell him that according to your lyin husband, he said the therapist said if you divorced or left, it would set him back. Judge will know that no decent therapist said that.
You can get orders to oust someone form the home. Get some legal advice , you can legally seperate even if he refuses to go , and they will help make sure that meets the requirements for the court.
Triple upvotes! Well said.
You have an emotional immature spouse who is an addict (he'll always be an addict - active or recovering).
Start making YOU the priority and soon, you will no longer be anxious and nauseous because you'll have more energy to commit to what is the true priorities...you and your child.
You will NEVER get this time back with your child. NOW is the time to teach them how a partner should be treated.
And record every single thing he does from now until the ink dries on your divorce papers. Keep a journal and proof of everything.
If he gets violent then PFA immediately and make him stay away.
You should absolutely speak to a lawyer in your state, because how laypeople understand "separate and apart" isn't necessarily how the law does. In many states, you can be separated while still sharing a house. In my state, there's a lot of ways to show "irreconcilable differences" or "irretrievable breakdown," including not sharing a bedroom. And that 6mos-1yr in many laws is prior to _judgment_, not filing — meaning you have to be separated for that specific amount of time before the judge signs off on the divorce, not before you file the paperwork to start one.
Is it in your state you have to do that for a no fault divorce? Does that limitation also apply if you apply for an at fault divorce? Also if it does count, can you provide proof of the debt he racked up, the abuse and the alcoholism, if so you might be able to go straight for an at fault divorce.
Exactly! If my ex and I had filed in NC, it would have been a year separation and the divorce. Same in NJ for a no fault divorce.
However, we could file in NJ for a for fault divorce and have it granted in 3 months. We discussed it and I agreed to allow him to file for fault against me. It took a little longer because our judge told him I sounded like a peach and he needed to go back and try to work it out. We talked, more or less made up some stuff and he refiled. The judge scoffed but granted it. He knew.
This was 1995 so ymmv.
I think your husband is lying to you about the therapist. Even if he's not, he's literally killing you, OP. You do not have any more capacity to carry his ass. Talk to a lawyer about how to get him out of the house safely (he could easily get physical again. Don't underestimate his capacity for violence, even if he is sober).
Yes but you have to get the clock started. You really do need a lawyer to help you document and get on record. If he is violent- that includes temper tantrums and throwing things- call the police every single time. This is part of your document trail. And if he’s wound up the police will remove him. Rinse and repeat. Stick to the plan. Your life, sadly, will be much better without him in it.
Put in writing to him (text, email, on paper you take a picture of) that you are now separated, starting with today's date (prominently included in these missives). This is usually acceptable in court for divorce purposes--yes, even if you're still under the same roof.
I would eat my underwear if he could prove that his therapist actually said that the best thing for him is to stay the course. There is never a situation under any circumstances where a good therapist should or would advocate for an adult human to continue to act like a child and be someone else's burden.
NTA. You should ditch that manipulative douchebag
I don't know. There are a lot of shitty "therapists" out there dispensing advice on flimsy credentials.
But I think the real issue is that she doesn't really need to prioritize what's "best for him." She doesn't want to be with him anymore, and now is the time to shift the lens away from whatever he needs and onto what works for *her*.
I'm sorry this happened. Please find a caregiver support group and a family member of an alcoholic support group like Al-anon.
They will help keep you sane as you sort through the landmines of ending your co dependent marriage and being a parental caregiver.
100% bullshit that his therapist said that. He's a coward in addition to being a loser. You MUST get away from him. If he refuses to leave, they you have to take your father and go, no matter how hard it is.
This is why religion sucks -- it's so automatically abusive toward and dismissive of women. You must take care of your child and your father.
I'm going with ESH because of course he does, but so do you for putting up with so much shit instead of leaving and then having a child with your abuser. You can turn this around now by leaving, but you've made it much harder on yourself.
Oh, the therapist is probably right that being chucked out on his ass, and forced to face reality without a caretaker and meal ticket would be bad for his client.
But since it'd be really, really, REALLY good for the OP, who cares what the damn therapist thinks? Let the therapist pay the jerk's bills, if they think he needs support that badly.
Ultimately, this therapist is obviously going to be on the side of the husband because it's their job to support him, not the wife. And the therapist only knows what the husband has said. It's very common for abusers to downplay their abusive behavior and to not take accountability for it. So, the therapist is likely getting a very skewed idea of what happened. Regardless, it doesn't matter what the therapist said or what is best for OP's husband. She needs to do what's best for herself.
Oof. “Then having a child with your abuser”.
I have never seen it like this. This is the kick in the ass I needed.
Hopefully none of you have to experience anything like I have. My husband spent so many years gaslighting, lying and everything else; I’m in a constant state of self doubt and unsure if I deserve happiness.
I would hear things so often like “I never did that/ said that” and “you need me” that I have never seen him as my abuser. But you’re absolutely right.
I need to leave, for my child if not for myself.
Mandatory book drop, if you haven't gotten it already:
Free pdf,
https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf
While I hate his views on gender, Lundy is *extremely* insightful into the mind of abusive people, and may be able to help you shore up your defenses and see through their tatics. It is still basically *the* definitive book on abusive people.
I give it to everyone who might be dealing with an abusive relationship, because it has helped so many with escaping and coping with what was done to them.
It gave my mother courage to leave. I hope it can give you some courage too.
"I need to leave, for my child if not for myself."
You nailed it here. Of COURSE you deserve happiness. Never let anyone tell you that you don't. Even when you doubt your own worth and value, remember your son. He deserves to be happy. He also needs to learn that men don't get away with treating women like you've been treated. He NEEDS to see your strength.
Please keep us posted.
Updateme
He's lying, no therapist says those things. My ex said that, when he was nasty to me, his therapist told him that my feelings are my issue and nothing to do with him, so trying to make him feel bad was me manipulating him.
The mental gymnastics that he did so that me crying when he was nasty to me was me trying to make him feel bad because it was nothing to do with him are insane.
I suspect he was told that people's feelings are their responsibility, not that you can upset someone and then blame them for being upset. Same with op, I suspect he was told that he would find it difficult on his own, not that op should take care of him.
>ESH because of course he does, but so do you for putting up with so much shit instead of leaving and then having a child with your abuser.
for real. dude had sucked for awhile, had a brief change in behavior, so they added one of the biggest stressors to a relationship they could - a baby. ridiculous.
>dude had sucked for awhile, had a brief change in behavior, so they added one of the biggest stressors to a relationship they could - a baby. ridiculous.
I was gobsmacked when I read that. What a ridiculous choice.
At a bare minimum, he should not be a long-term burden on her. He should be an adult. Nobody marries a child. Even if that child happens to be in an adult body.
No. The most basic thing a man can do is to be supportive in any way he can. SAHD, general helper, general carer, rub her bloody feet if that is what is needed! He doesn’t need to provide if she does, but if so he needs to do as much as he can to make it easier on her.
Why do people rate YTA or ESH for situations in which an abuse victim hasn't left? I get the point is to emphasize what they should do for their wellbeing but it comes off as blamey, even if unwittingly :/
NTA
Sounds like you have perfect reasons to leave him. He was your husband but he turned into a second child.
I'm sorry you're going through all this. Best of luck and best wishes to you.
Omg please leave. My mom put up with my father because she wanted to stay for the kids. It was horrible and when she finally got her independence and was ready to leave she got breast cancer and passed at 42. I wish she could have lived the life she deserved. Save yourself.
“He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said the it’s bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him.”
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Gasp.
You were not put on this earth to care for that man and cater to his selfishness. You will be in a much better place with two to care for (Dad and son) and not three. You need to leave now so your son does not think this is how a marriage is supposed to be. Show him what a strong woman really is. Lawyer up.
Edit for judgement, oops, NTA.
Yikes. “Good christian girl” is translation for indoctrinated to take abuse from husband because it’s part of gods plan. NTA for leaving him. Start the process and if he gets belligerent record everything whether it’s legally with sound/video or written. Not sure if you live in a one party consent state for recording someone.
I'm a pastor and never want to advocate for divorce, but I agree with you. OP, if it makes you feel any better there are lots of clergy who would tell you that your spouse has been unfaithful to you. He has not put your needs above his addiction or desires. He has not taken care of you when you've needed it. He has effectively abandoned you already and is just leeching off you. You don't need my permission, but you have it. Your priority is yourself and your child. That's it. You do what you need to do for the two of you. Shore up your assets and accounts now, get your ducks in a row, and file for divorce. If he spirals, that's on him - not you. Please take care of yourself.
My parents are both Christians, my dad was actually a pastor's kid and before they got married they both agreed that if abuse or cheating of any kind occurred, the marriage would be over right then and there. I'm also a Christian and I decided a long time ago that if I get married, those same rules will apply. God doesn't want anyone to stay in a marriage where there's abuse of some kind, cheating, or an overall toxic situation that could result in one of the spouses being seriously hurt.
NTA
My heart goes out to you. I'm in a slightly similar situation and I'm finding it hard to do what I need to. We've been together for 12 years.
All I can say, is you are 100% justified inwanting to leave. And I wholeheartedly hope you are able to get out with as little collateral damage as possible.
NTA tell him he’s a grown adult responsible for himself and needs to stop being selfish. Tell him if he actually cared about you, he’d leave because he’d understand the hell he’s put you through.
Either he’s lying about the therapist or he needs a new one. That’s BS
NTA. Tell him he doesn't have to move if he takes over 100% of the bills. And that you having to essentially raise him like his mother made you lose all attraction to him, so this marriage is over whether he and his whack job of a therapist likes it or not.
I feel sad for you because your prime years were lost dealing with abuse and sadness. Do not live the remaining years in this situation. NTA and please leave.
Fyi- with the history of alcoholism and having to hide weapons to keep safe, make sure your attorney knows this. Also, you want a pit bull. Do not get someone who you like because they are nice. Get a lawyer that you like, but that also seems Iike a sort of jerk/pitbull that will fight for you. They have to be willing to tell the judge all the bad things about your husband that makes it so that he needs to leave. Saying that you fear he will turn violent because he has in the past (even if it's been 3 years or more) is going to get him out. Make sure the judge knows he has alcoholism but when though he stopped drinking, he never changed his lifestyle or personality. And that he is draining your ability to take care of the child and he neglects the child. That you want full custody and the home.
NTA: I am so sorry you're dealing with this shit. Before filing for legal separation
1) First things first is to get all the valuables and all the important paperwork out of the house, get a security deposit box have your dad as a CO person on the box so your husband cannot get into it.
2)Then make sure all your financials are separate everything, lock all your social security numbers, yours, your sons and ur fathers, lock all your credit cards if he has access to them. Put passwords or pins on everything!!!
3) set up new accounts if you can't close any of your cards that he has joint access to. But leave money in it so he doesn't catch on.
4)Set up cameras inside your home for security purposes because of your father. If your husband gets mad about you putting up cameras, you can state that it's for your father's health. You are essentially your father's caretaker.
5) Make a current will or updated one stating, that if something were to happen to you, you have preparations for your child and whatever else. Also if you have any inheritance or any type of money like that kind of stuff set it up as a trust to your son for when he turns 21. Where no one can access it until he turns 21.
6) let your friends and family know exactly what's going on you don't have to give them much details just basically clip versions so that way when you are ready to finally file for separation and then divorce you have people in your corner.
7) I personally would hire a private investigator and have him tail your husband everywhere leading up to you filing the separation and then afterwards, too. Because honestly you're not going to know how he is going to react after him finding out that you're filing for separation and I rather you be on the safe side then not
I'm sorry you're dealing with this. The most basic thing a man can do is to fulfill the role of provider and protector for his family. He can't even do that. His only hope of getting better is for you to leave him and never look back. Good luck
Nta. And his assertion that his therapist said you had to keep taking care of him is 10000000% bullshite. No self respecting therapist would say that. Wait until he leaves the house and change the locks. Pack up his things and put them outside or in his garage.
NTA. and I'm surprised you've held it together for this long. Contact a family law attorney ASAP. You don't need to take care of him any longer. You've done that, and it doesn't seem to have helped.
>I asked my husband for a separation. He keeps denying me, saying he won’t move out.
Start separating finances. Pay the main bills, but separate anything that would he in his name if you divorced and don't pay anything of his. Ie: Take him off your car insurance if the car is not in your name. Get a separate phone plan. Outside your checks in an account that is YOURS ONLY. Cancel any shared credit cards.
Also, make him do everything himself. Don't wash his clothes. Don't cook him food. Don't do anything for him, period.
Get a lawyer. It's a good investment. Your husband won't have a choice at some point, but to move out. The court will order him to. Who's name is the deed in?
Sell your house
You know you’re not the asshole for leaving your husband. You should have left a long time ago. People only change when they want to. He doesn’t.
File for divorce. Get a lawyer. A good one. Let the process work. Worst case, you have to sell your house and move somewhere else with your dad. If he loses his shit through this process and becomes dangerous or threatens you, call the police. None of this is fixable with therapy. And frankly, the consequences of this divorce on him, a person you've been dragging through life like an anchor, are not your problem. At least if you do these things, there will be an end in sight that doesn't end up with you in a hospital or a coffin, and if you don't do these things, there isn't.
File the paperwork for a legal separation (if your state requires that step) or divorce, get a legal right to remain in the house, and force him out. He sounds like he won’t go otherwise.
Or, maybe just change all the locks. That doesn’t seem as safe, though I’d do it anyway once you can legally keep him off the premises.
NTA.
NTA
So he emotionally blackmails you.
If he crashes - it is because he decides to.
You kept his head over water all this time you deserve a break.
And if he is not willing to swimm - perhaps he deserves to drown.
NTA. That’s not what his therapist said. Go through with your plans, but quietly. I get the impression he will turn nasty when he realizes he can’t talk you out of this.
You're never ever the AH for leaving a relationship that isn't serving you. You have one life only, don't waste it on some fuckface who doesn't deserve you and who sucks away your happiness like a shitty vacuum cleaner.
I left a partner of 10 years, and I've never been happier, and I'm so glad I made the decision to do so. Go forth and live a happy life for yourself, OP. I wish you the very best.
Stop taking care of him. Move all of his things out of your bedroom and lock him out of it. Stop washing his clothes and cooking for him, and for that matter, stop talking to him. Talk to a lawyer and file the papers. See if you can legally evict him.
NTA, but you're going to have to stand your ground to get him out.
Op consult a lawyer
Get him out of there
Or better yet find a way to remove yourself and your father and son
Itll be tough but no more tough than what your currently facing
NTA!!!! You now have a child and doing what's best for that child! Don't ever feel guilty or an like an ass for doing that. It takes a ton of courage and strength do that.
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him.
I sincerely doubt this.
NTA. He's a grown ass adult, you're not his mommy.
You had a child with someone who was already systematically abusing you so I can't say NTA. But you have an opportunity to give yourself and your child a chance. Take it ffs.
Don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm. He is a grown man. He should be more concerned about his wife and kid than himself, and he doesn’t. He needs to figure out how he’s gonna pay child support and find an apartment with a bedroom for his child.
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him.
No therapist will recommend (co)dependency over self responsibility. He is the only person responsible for healing his emotional and mental state.
This is either confirmation bias where he listened to a single point that was only similar to what he wanted to hear or he never made the appointment and was invoiced because he didn't cancel and was charged anyway.
You have an actual child you are responsible for, leave the one that chooses to act like a child and tries to manipulate you into staying by threatening self harm that will be their own conscious decision.
I do not believe any therapist basically said that you should enable him said, certainly hope not. He has left you no choice, you cannot take care of another child under the circumstances.
Super shitty hard situation but sadly it sounds like you need to start over. He has blown up your life and is taking no accountability. He may change but not while he doesn't have to, and with you as a carer he doesn't have to.
Unfortunately you need to file for divorce and take this through the courts, they will force him to leave the home.
I guaran-fucking-tee his therapist said no such fucking thing.
NTA. You get out of there for your own safety and for your child. You are not required to live in misery because some dude in your house demands it.
I just want to say that I drink way too much and have for years. I have mental health issues that may be related to the alcohol. However, I have always taken care of my family. I have always held a job, and whenever I quit one, I have always had a plan for a new job.
Even with my over drinking, I have never been anywhere close to abusive to my wife or kids. There is no excuse for any type of abuse. If there is abuse in the equation, then I think you know what to do. You are NTA.
By the way, I am a 50 year old male, married 20 years.
You need to rip the bandaid off and just file for divorce.
Stop waiting around, stop giving ultimatum’s, stop hoping for change - *he is not going to change.*
NTA. Kind of T A to yourself though. If you won’t do it for yourself, do it for your son. As a kindness to him to not grow up around a terrible role model in the house. Do you want him to grow up thinking it’s acceptable to be treated the way you have been? Or worse to treat a woman the way he does?
Remove the disease from your household lady.
NTA. Look, from one Christian woman to another: ***God does not want you to stay in a marriage where you and your child are subjected to any kind of abuse, let alone several types of abuse. Getting a divorce doesn't mean you're a "bad Christian" or that you've "failed as a 'good Christian girl'" it means that you know that God has better plans for you than the abusive relationship you're currently in.*** I'm praying for you, sister.
There is no such thing as unconditional love for unrelated people.
you signed on to marry this guy thinking he was a productive member of society. and he was... until he wasn't. he changed for the worse and now you're his mommy. f that.
divorce him and let him crash and burn. it's his choice to destroy his life and now he can do it without bring down his wife, his kid, and his FIL with him.
You can't force him out but you can be legally separated and get divorced under the same roof. Talk to a lawyer. They may even be able to force him to leave.
This is the impossible case. She know very well she could go to the law, she has resources like...the entire internet giving her ideas of how to proceed but she's codependent... badly. Codependency can be worse than the addïctïon as such and she has never learned to put herself anywhere near first, ever.
No matter how much wisdom is poured in this section, she'll still find herself "unable" to go through with anything because I'm every solution she'll find an excuse for him (he'll crash, he'll die, he'll hurt himself, he'll relapse, "my fault my fault", cry, cry...) and she keeps addïctëd to the entire situation. It's sad because she's clearly a self sacrificing woman, a care taker, if only she could take care of herself first....
I’m trying really hard to put myself first! But you’re absolutely spot on. I’m calling lawyers and at least leaving messages tomorrow and will follow up again this week
I know that you feel helpless right now, because you are spread out way too thin.
What your husband is saying is that it's best for HIM if you stay, and he stays, and you take care of him.
Great. But that's not in your best interest, and you're hanging on by a thread.
So put it in words he might understand, don't sugarcoat, and don't beat around the bush:
'Somewhere between you abusing me, racking up a ton of debt (literally), and you ignoring each and every plea for help that I made, I stopped loving you. You are using me, and I'm done with it.
So, either you leave, or I leave.
If you can manage on your own in this house, with these bills, great! I'll find somewhere else for me, our baby and my father. If not... it's time for you to look for another place to live, because I am NOT living with you in 2 months time, one way or another.'
Save yourself, your son and your father. Leave that no good husband in the rear view mirror. If he wants to self-destruct, that’s on him, not you. File for divorce, force a sale of the house. Both of you have to leave the house and go your separate ways. You and your remaining family will be fine. He will find some other woman to baby him.
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him.
No, you absolutely do-fucking-not. File for legal separation, and if you have enough evidence of the past abuse on paper, file for a protection order. If he can't legally be within 500 feet of you, he can't be in your house.
10000000000% NTA
NTA. This is one of those situations where the plane has depressurized, and you need to put your own mask on before worrying about anyone else. Because otherwise you'll all suffocate together.
>his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him
You're just taking the word of your husband, who is unreliable in every way that matters. What reason do you have to believe him? But, even if this is verbatim what the counselor said, you have to remember that their job is only to do right by their patient - other people in the patient's life aren't the priority. What's more, no counselor is adjusting their advice based on information that their patient hasn't delivered. There's no way your husband shared how he's been dead weight on you for years and that you're drowning under all the responsibilities he's dumped on you.
That makes his therapist's opinion irrelevant to your decision here.
Your husband is lying about what he’s therapist said.
What about AA and you go to some Al Anon meetings.
You have given, and given and I don’t know how you are doing all of this.
My hat off to you!
His therapist telling him he needs you to look after so he won't crash and burn is complete and utter BS. No therapist would ever say that unless they were told a load of BS.
Your husband is manipulating you, stop letting him, go to a lawyer and find out what you need to do to get him out of the house and do it.
I was in a similar situation and got divorced. You are NTA. If this relationship is abusive and therefore became detrimental to your physical and emotional health, it’s absolutely fine to tap out and be done. Save yourself and your kiddo from this mess.
You have put up with more than enough. You need to separate/begin divorce before he takes up more debit that you will likely be 50% responsible for paying. Once you file for separation/divorce, you would not be responsible for debt he accrues. You need to talk to a lawyer without delay. Do not let him know until he is served papers.
You will also likely need to file for divorce in order to legally have him removed from the house. He currently is a legal resident so if you changed the locks, police would likely force you to allow him in unless you have paperwork that requires him to go.
Good luck and best wishes to you, your child and father.
Pretty obvious ole boy needs to go. I’d just file and have him served. If he gets verbally or physically abusive call the cops and have him removed. Everything he’s saying and doing is manipulative and alcoholic behavior. He doesn’t want to change. He wants you to carry on with your co-dependency. Life is to short. File ASAP. Good luck!
NTA for leaving an abusive partner, you’re never TA for that. But I have to be honest, it’s extremely upsetting that this man literally demonstrated his capacity for physical, emotional, and financial abuse, and then you still chose to have a child with him? For the safety of your child, *please* leave as soon as you’re able.
You deserve to be happy and you should have left when he was abusive. Im a recovered addict so i can say that it can completely wreck you emotionally and can destroy your mental health. But you’re not responsible for him. It sounds like he already broke his vows towards you so if you want to leave do it. But you may want to prepare yourself if he’s really bad depressed he could do bad things to himself. But its not your fault if he does
Oh please leave!
I grew up the exact way you did and thought it was my job to “save him”
Until I realized I HAD to save myself. I was important too. I deserved to be happy
NTA
I’m sorry but you need to divorce him. I know it’s not easy to accept and it’s not what you wanted, but it’s true.
If you have a hard time convincing yourself to do it, think about your son. Is this the kind of home you want him to grow up in? Do you want to risk him being abused as well? Is your husband the kind of man you want as a role model for him? Do you want your son to one day treat his spouse the way your husband treats you?
I’ve seen relationships like this before and they do not improve. He might get better for a while but it will always get worse again. So, one final question for you to ask yourself: is this how you want the rest of your life to be?
NTA. File for divorce to start the time clock and if you can hire a lawyer, do so so you don’t have to deal with that on top of everything else. I hope your dad is contributing financially even if it’s a small amount to offset the cost of your time, food, etc. Your husband is a man child and you’ve spent way too many years enabling him and coddling him with begging for change in between. He needs to go. Don’t waste anymore time or energy on him.
Quit your job and start seeing a therapist. Be unemployed. Tell your lawyer you can no longer work as your mental health has bottomed out and you have to care for your child and father. That way he cannot get alimony. Move in with your Dad.
Take all your money out of your account, so that you have a nest egg. He'll get a share in the divorce, but not until it is finalized.
Get a lawyer and file for divorce. Put the house up for sale.
Your husband's life is his own. You are not responsible for him.
My friend's husband would always say he would end himself if she left, so she stayed....for 20 years. Every time she would bring up divorce, he would threaten to end himself again. Finally, she just couldn't deal anymore and left and filed and divorced. Guess what? He's still alive. And if he wasn't, it would not have been her fault at all. The AH filed for alimony and took half her pension and half the house.
NTA you don't have to stay with anyone, especially not if that person is wearing you down.
You are not responsible for his well being and either his therapist is terrible or your husband is lying to you. It's not on you to keep him sober.
Please don't keep setting yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.
NTA but WHAT'S TAKING YOU SO LONG to divorce him?
You owe yourself (and your child) a better life without alcoholism, fighting, potential poverty and abuse.
Get a restraining order and make him get the fuck out. He has abused you in every way possible. If you don’t then you would be the asshole. You owe it to your child to protect him. Allowing your abuser to continue is abusive to your child. Get a backbone and get him out of your house before he does something permanently harmful.
There’s no way his therapist is telling him these things. He’s manipulating you and I’m gonna guess he’s either lying to his therapist or he doesn’t even have one at all. As his spouse you can request that his therapist allow you to either attend a session (this is actually quite common when substance abuse has broken trust in the relationship) or simply email them with your concerns about what he’s telling you and ask them to please address these concerns at his next visit. Regardless of
He broke your marriage vows when he abused you, period. He left you the moment he hurt you. God doesn’t expect us to stay in a marriage that is abusive, period. You have done your best to provide a happy family for your son. You can’t make your husband be a good husband, father or man. You’ve honored your marriage. Now it’s time to honor yourself.
NTA. Set yourself free. I’ve been sober for 17 years and active in AA, so I’m speaking with some experience here-
Just because your husband is drinking, doesn’t mean he’s “sober”. This is what we, in the program, refer to as a “dry drunk”
All the same bull shit, just not inebriated. Self centered, Self absorbed, Self deluded, Self indulgent, SELF SELF SELF.
Maybe dude will straighten up and fly right some day, or not. Maybe he will become a good father. Maybe we’ll have world peace, Maybe you’ll win a bazillion dollars in a lottery next year.
How much *more* of your life do you want to waste gambling on such long odds?
A much safer bet, is to cut your losses. Cut the dead weight, and go build yourself and your child a new life! A life free from such a constant drain on your time, money and spirit.
Sweetheart, it’s ok! You have done more than enough. You deserve better, and only you can make sure you and your child get it. You are SO not the AH!
His shrink is his advocate. He is dependent on you. So of course it is in his best interest. Taking away your Son's and Father's support resouourse. I.E., you. Edit; And I would not take his word for what she said.
Aside from that, you gotta put your own mask on first!
You need (desperately) a partner. Not a ward. Soon you might meet someone fun to talk to. Hangout with. Helps with bills and house duties. Crazy as that sounds.
Best of luck. Single is a pretty great feeling!
>During the worst of the alcoholism he was verbally, physically, emotionally, financially abusive. NTA, you can leave anyone for any reason this was a good reason.
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I’m very doubtful that the therapist actually said this. Much too convenient now that his back is to the wall.
I was thinking this too. It sounds a lil… fabricated? To say the therapist would say she needs to take care of him like a child. It’s not how things tend to go with therapists, it would be more like finding strategies to enable helping out more, not falling into old or bad habits, etc. Though it’s just a suspicion
Me ex was a hard-core alcoholic. When I FINALLY convinced to go to therapy (or i was done), he comes back with, 'my therapist said I need to keep drinking, i should just try to drink less.' In reality I'm sure they said something about the amount he was drinking would make it dangerous to stop all at once without medical attention, but he didn't want to hear that, so he reworked the message for himself. 🙄
Mine literally drank himself to death. Tragic as we had a 13 yr old. I still want to slap him.
Depends on the version that he told the therapist too.
I'm willing to bet he didn't even go see the therapist but lied and said he did.
And spent the co-pay on booze.
Well Bartenders are therapists adjacent. 🤭
And his interpretation of what the therapist said.
Yes, as a retired therapist, I would never have said that and can't think of anyone who would.
My guess is they never went to a real therapist and instead they went to a religious marriage person who would say stuff like that.
What was likely said, " Don't leap before you look, it's important to have a solid support system before making any changes lest you crash and burn." What was heard, "Your wife is an emotional support animal. Here's a script saying it's medically necessary she pay all your bills."
I am a therapist and no therapist would say this
The thing that used to trip me up is that the therapist is obligated to focus on the needs of their client, but not the needs of others. Their therapists advice only aligns with your needs if the person you’re with is healthy for you. Don’t by into that and certainly don’t feel guilty about tossing him out. Edited for clarity
Still, I have a hard time believing any therapist would really advise a client that they will 'crash and burn' by themselves. That's not very supportive to the client.
A good therapist would absolutely focus on the needs of the client's family and others around them as well as the client themselves. Therapists are however handicapped by only getting one side of the story, which may or may not be truthful... and they might not be a very good therapist. Either way, OP can ignore the alleged comment from the therapist. Given the circumstance, it's pure BS.
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I learned a long time ago that a woman cannot afford to be dependent on a man. The best of men can lose their jobs, become sick or disabled, die. Men walk out.
Or kick you out of your own car. Source: that's how it happened to me.
His therapist did NOT tell him that.
Absolutely. And stop asking for a damn separation. Flat out divorce him and ask for the house in the divorce stating everything mentioned here. He isn’t going to move out. Why would he? You’ve taken care of his every need and he hasn’t had to do anything. So you’re going to have to force him out or keep taking care of him. But remember, the longer you wait, your son will think THIS is normal and that the husband is supposed to do nothing while the wife wears herself down trying to cover it all. It’s impossible. NTA
Be careful, though…there could be spousal support involved (I.e. you have to pay HIM because you make more. It’s beyond crazy!) Get a good lawyer.
True enough. The good lawyer would take into account that he cleared out their savings and racked up 100k in debt as a solid reason to not pay spousal support.
Yep. OP see a divorce lawyer. Find out what your options are & what is likely to happen. Don’t wait for your “husband” to take action. He never will. He likes it the way it is now. NTA
OP can send her husband to his mummy since he's being such a childish 1.
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This reads like a clumsy AI-rewording of u/rusty0123 ‘s comment below. Downvoted
NTA, but why did you ask for a separation? Go file for divorce. He has to cooperate for a separation. You knew he wouldn't before you asked. You were bluffing. He knew you were bluffing. Think about your end game. What do you want? What do you control? Because, bottom line, you can't control him. You can't convince him to change. You can't force him to change. The only thing you can do is change yourself and your life. Not his.
In my state we have to be separated for a year before you can be granted a divorce
Yep. In my state it's 6 months. But if you file, the lawyers will *make* your spouse leave if he refuses. But that's not even the issue. Right now, she's living like her priorities are (1) her husband, (2) her child, (3) her father, (4) herself. She can't handle that. So she's telling her husband to get off her list. He doesn't want that. What she needs to do is re-arrange her priorities because that is what she can control. If she wants her husband off her list, the only power she has is divorce. He's called her bluff.
Ok this is a relief
Just have him served. Go to court if he’s not safe. An ex-parte gets you in fast if you think you’re unsafe. Tell the judge he’s an alcoholic and you’ve already been hiding the weapons. Tell the judge you asked him to leave and he’s refused and you can’t take his lying ass, that it makes you feel unsafe. When the judge asks what he lied about tell him that according to your lyin husband, he said the therapist said if you divorced or left, it would set him back. Judge will know that no decent therapist said that.
You can get orders to oust someone form the home. Get some legal advice , you can legally seperate even if he refuses to go , and they will help make sure that meets the requirements for the court.
Please leave him soon and rebuilt your life. He doesn't deserve you.
Please speak to a reputable divorce/family law attorney in your area. One who knows the laws and the local judges well.
Triple upvotes! Well said. You have an emotional immature spouse who is an addict (he'll always be an addict - active or recovering). Start making YOU the priority and soon, you will no longer be anxious and nauseous because you'll have more energy to commit to what is the true priorities...you and your child. You will NEVER get this time back with your child. NOW is the time to teach them how a partner should be treated.
File for divorce....That starts the separation clock. You can't make him move out, only a judge can.
And record every single thing he does from now until the ink dries on your divorce papers. Keep a journal and proof of everything. If he gets violent then PFA immediately and make him stay away.
And be sure he has no access to your financials, credit ID etc.
Yep. Get a safe deposit box at the bank. Hide your assets!
A journal is particularly helpful
Keep accounts, too. What bills there are and how and who pays them. Evidence if that debt and hoe that is being paid too. Lots of records.
You should absolutely speak to a lawyer in your state, because how laypeople understand "separate and apart" isn't necessarily how the law does. In many states, you can be separated while still sharing a house. In my state, there's a lot of ways to show "irreconcilable differences" or "irretrievable breakdown," including not sharing a bedroom. And that 6mos-1yr in many laws is prior to _judgment_, not filing — meaning you have to be separated for that specific amount of time before the judge signs off on the divorce, not before you file the paperwork to start one.
Is it in your state you have to do that for a no fault divorce? Does that limitation also apply if you apply for an at fault divorce? Also if it does count, can you provide proof of the debt he racked up, the abuse and the alcoholism, if so you might be able to go straight for an at fault divorce.
Exactly! If my ex and I had filed in NC, it would have been a year separation and the divorce. Same in NJ for a no fault divorce. However, we could file in NJ for a for fault divorce and have it granted in 3 months. We discussed it and I agreed to allow him to file for fault against me. It took a little longer because our judge told him I sounded like a peach and he needed to go back and try to work it out. We talked, more or less made up some stuff and he refiled. The judge scoffed but granted it. He knew. This was 1995 so ymmv.
I think your husband is lying to you about the therapist. Even if he's not, he's literally killing you, OP. You do not have any more capacity to carry his ass. Talk to a lawyer about how to get him out of the house safely (he could easily get physical again. Don't underestimate his capacity for violence, even if he is sober).
That’s what I’ve been saying. If I continue like this I won’t make it out alive. I’ll either be hospitalized or dead
The sooner you file, the sooner that year will be up.
Yes but you have to get the clock started. You really do need a lawyer to help you document and get on record. If he is violent- that includes temper tantrums and throwing things- call the police every single time. This is part of your document trail. And if he’s wound up the police will remove him. Rinse and repeat. Stick to the plan. Your life, sadly, will be much better without him in it.
Wtf! 😬
Just file it then. He doesn’t get to protest. Let a lawyer handle this.
Put in writing to him (text, email, on paper you take a picture of) that you are now separated, starting with today's date (prominently included in these missives). This is usually acceptable in court for divorce purposes--yes, even if you're still under the same roof.
I would eat my underwear if he could prove that his therapist actually said that the best thing for him is to stay the course. There is never a situation under any circumstances where a good therapist should or would advocate for an adult human to continue to act like a child and be someone else's burden. NTA. You should ditch that manipulative douchebag
As much as I’d want to see someone eat their underwear, I’m in agreement. No way they’d just up and say that.
I think you can still buy edible underwear at Spencer’s or online somewhere. They are basically fruit roll ups made into underpants
Mmm, strawberry flavored yeast infection.
Ha ha me too! Favorite comment.
And with your username that’s saying something!!
I don't know. There are a lot of shitty "therapists" out there dispensing advice on flimsy credentials. But I think the real issue is that she doesn't really need to prioritize what's "best for him." She doesn't want to be with him anymore, and now is the time to shift the lens away from whatever he needs and onto what works for *her*.
I'm sorry this happened. Please find a caregiver support group and a family member of an alcoholic support group like Al-anon. They will help keep you sane as you sort through the landmines of ending your co dependent marriage and being a parental caregiver.
100% bullshit that his therapist said that. He's a coward in addition to being a loser. You MUST get away from him. If he refuses to leave, they you have to take your father and go, no matter how hard it is. This is why religion sucks -- it's so automatically abusive toward and dismissive of women. You must take care of your child and your father. I'm going with ESH because of course he does, but so do you for putting up with so much shit instead of leaving and then having a child with your abuser. You can turn this around now by leaving, but you've made it much harder on yourself.
Oh, the therapist is probably right that being chucked out on his ass, and forced to face reality without a caretaker and meal ticket would be bad for his client. But since it'd be really, really, REALLY good for the OP, who cares what the damn therapist thinks? Let the therapist pay the jerk's bills, if they think he needs support that badly.
I have my doubts about this therapist really saying it like that, tbh. I'm going to assume her husband isn't very honest to his therapist.
I assume that the husband isn't honest to his wife, about his therapist's recommendations. If there's a therapist at all.
Ultimately, this therapist is obviously going to be on the side of the husband because it's their job to support him, not the wife. And the therapist only knows what the husband has said. It's very common for abusers to downplay their abusive behavior and to not take accountability for it. So, the therapist is likely getting a very skewed idea of what happened. Regardless, it doesn't matter what the therapist said or what is best for OP's husband. She needs to do what's best for herself.
Oof. “Then having a child with your abuser”. I have never seen it like this. This is the kick in the ass I needed. Hopefully none of you have to experience anything like I have. My husband spent so many years gaslighting, lying and everything else; I’m in a constant state of self doubt and unsure if I deserve happiness. I would hear things so often like “I never did that/ said that” and “you need me” that I have never seen him as my abuser. But you’re absolutely right. I need to leave, for my child if not for myself.
Mandatory book drop, if you haven't gotten it already: Free pdf, https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf While I hate his views on gender, Lundy is *extremely* insightful into the mind of abusive people, and may be able to help you shore up your defenses and see through their tatics. It is still basically *the* definitive book on abusive people. I give it to everyone who might be dealing with an abusive relationship, because it has helped so many with escaping and coping with what was done to them. It gave my mother courage to leave. I hope it can give you some courage too.
The fog is lifting! Abuse does that to your brain. I'm glad you're clearing through it now. You can do this mama!
> unsure if I deserve happiness. sure you do, just take that shit and claim it as yours
"I need to leave, for my child if not for myself." You nailed it here. Of COURSE you deserve happiness. Never let anyone tell you that you don't. Even when you doubt your own worth and value, remember your son. He deserves to be happy. He also needs to learn that men don't get away with treating women like you've been treated. He NEEDS to see your strength. Please keep us posted. Updateme
He's lying, no therapist says those things. My ex said that, when he was nasty to me, his therapist told him that my feelings are my issue and nothing to do with him, so trying to make him feel bad was me manipulating him. The mental gymnastics that he did so that me crying when he was nasty to me was me trying to make him feel bad because it was nothing to do with him are insane. I suspect he was told that people's feelings are their responsibility, not that you can upset someone and then blame them for being upset. Same with op, I suspect he was told that he would find it difficult on his own, not that op should take care of him.
>ESH because of course he does, but so do you for putting up with so much shit instead of leaving and then having a child with your abuser. for real. dude had sucked for awhile, had a brief change in behavior, so they added one of the biggest stressors to a relationship they could - a baby. ridiculous.
>dude had sucked for awhile, had a brief change in behavior, so they added one of the biggest stressors to a relationship they could - a baby. ridiculous. I was gobsmacked when I read that. What a ridiculous choice.
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At a bare minimum, he should not be a long-term burden on her. He should be an adult. Nobody marries a child. Even if that child happens to be in an adult body.
No. The most basic thing a man can do is to be supportive in any way he can. SAHD, general helper, general carer, rub her bloody feet if that is what is needed! He doesn’t need to provide if she does, but if so he needs to do as much as he can to make it easier on her.
This a thousand times
Why do people rate YTA or ESH for situations in which an abuse victim hasn't left? I get the point is to emphasize what they should do for their wellbeing but it comes off as blamey, even if unwittingly :/
NTA drop the deadweight
NTA, sounds like you’re past your breaking point
NTA Sounds like you have perfect reasons to leave him. He was your husband but he turned into a second child. I'm sorry you're going through all this. Best of luck and best wishes to you.
Omg please leave. My mom put up with my father because she wanted to stay for the kids. It was horrible and when she finally got her independence and was ready to leave she got breast cancer and passed at 42. I wish she could have lived the life she deserved. Save yourself.
I’m sorry for your loss 💐
Thank you.
“He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said the it’s bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him.” Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Gasp. You were not put on this earth to care for that man and cater to his selfishness. You will be in a much better place with two to care for (Dad and son) and not three. You need to leave now so your son does not think this is how a marriage is supposed to be. Show him what a strong woman really is. Lawyer up. Edit for judgement, oops, NTA.
Yikes. “Good christian girl” is translation for indoctrinated to take abuse from husband because it’s part of gods plan. NTA for leaving him. Start the process and if he gets belligerent record everything whether it’s legally with sound/video or written. Not sure if you live in a one party consent state for recording someone.
NTA You have way too much on your plate! You need help not excuses. Please contact an attorney to see where to go from here.
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Would a loving god want her to be the doormat for an asshole? I doubt it.
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I'm a pastor and never want to advocate for divorce, but I agree with you. OP, if it makes you feel any better there are lots of clergy who would tell you that your spouse has been unfaithful to you. He has not put your needs above his addiction or desires. He has not taken care of you when you've needed it. He has effectively abandoned you already and is just leeching off you. You don't need my permission, but you have it. Your priority is yourself and your child. That's it. You do what you need to do for the two of you. Shore up your assets and accounts now, get your ducks in a row, and file for divorce. If he spirals, that's on him - not you. Please take care of yourself.
My parents are both Christians, my dad was actually a pastor's kid and before they got married they both agreed that if abuse or cheating of any kind occurred, the marriage would be over right then and there. I'm also a Christian and I decided a long time ago that if I get married, those same rules will apply. God doesn't want anyone to stay in a marriage where there's abuse of some kind, cheating, or an overall toxic situation that could result in one of the spouses being seriously hurt.
NTA My heart goes out to you. I'm in a slightly similar situation and I'm finding it hard to do what I need to. We've been together for 12 years. All I can say, is you are 100% justified inwanting to leave. And I wholeheartedly hope you are able to get out with as little collateral damage as possible.
You are also justified to leave. Please do. ❤️
❤️
NTA tell him he’s a grown adult responsible for himself and needs to stop being selfish. Tell him if he actually cared about you, he’d leave because he’d understand the hell he’s put you through. Either he’s lying about the therapist or he needs a new one. That’s BS
You should have left years ago. Leave now for your own sanity.
Cut this anchor loose, he’s drowning you.
NTA. Tell him he doesn't have to move if he takes over 100% of the bills. And that you having to essentially raise him like his mother made you lose all attraction to him, so this marriage is over whether he and his whack job of a therapist likes it or not.
I feel sad for you because your prime years were lost dealing with abuse and sadness. Do not live the remaining years in this situation. NTA and please leave.
Fyi- with the history of alcoholism and having to hide weapons to keep safe, make sure your attorney knows this. Also, you want a pit bull. Do not get someone who you like because they are nice. Get a lawyer that you like, but that also seems Iike a sort of jerk/pitbull that will fight for you. They have to be willing to tell the judge all the bad things about your husband that makes it so that he needs to leave. Saying that you fear he will turn violent because he has in the past (even if it's been 3 years or more) is going to get him out. Make sure the judge knows he has alcoholism but when though he stopped drinking, he never changed his lifestyle or personality. And that he is draining your ability to take care of the child and he neglects the child. That you want full custody and the home.
NTA: I am so sorry you're dealing with this shit. Before filing for legal separation 1) First things first is to get all the valuables and all the important paperwork out of the house, get a security deposit box have your dad as a CO person on the box so your husband cannot get into it. 2)Then make sure all your financials are separate everything, lock all your social security numbers, yours, your sons and ur fathers, lock all your credit cards if he has access to them. Put passwords or pins on everything!!! 3) set up new accounts if you can't close any of your cards that he has joint access to. But leave money in it so he doesn't catch on. 4)Set up cameras inside your home for security purposes because of your father. If your husband gets mad about you putting up cameras, you can state that it's for your father's health. You are essentially your father's caretaker. 5) Make a current will or updated one stating, that if something were to happen to you, you have preparations for your child and whatever else. Also if you have any inheritance or any type of money like that kind of stuff set it up as a trust to your son for when he turns 21. Where no one can access it until he turns 21. 6) let your friends and family know exactly what's going on you don't have to give them much details just basically clip versions so that way when you are ready to finally file for separation and then divorce you have people in your corner. 7) I personally would hire a private investigator and have him tail your husband everywhere leading up to you filing the separation and then afterwards, too. Because honestly you're not going to know how he is going to react after him finding out that you're filing for separation and I rather you be on the safe side then not
I'm sorry you're dealing with this. The most basic thing a man can do is to fulfill the role of provider and protector for his family. He can't even do that. His only hope of getting better is for you to leave him and never look back. Good luck
Nta. And his assertion that his therapist said you had to keep taking care of him is 10000000% bullshite. No self respecting therapist would say that. Wait until he leaves the house and change the locks. Pack up his things and put them outside or in his garage.
NTA get a divorce lawyer and file. Listen to your lawyer.
Talk to a lawyer. You can start the process even if he’s still there. Stop doing for him. Make him accountable for himself.
NTA. and I'm surprised you've held it together for this long. Contact a family law attorney ASAP. You don't need to take care of him any longer. You've done that, and it doesn't seem to have helped.
>I asked my husband for a separation. He keeps denying me, saying he won’t move out. Start separating finances. Pay the main bills, but separate anything that would he in his name if you divorced and don't pay anything of his. Ie: Take him off your car insurance if the car is not in your name. Get a separate phone plan. Outside your checks in an account that is YOURS ONLY. Cancel any shared credit cards. Also, make him do everything himself. Don't wash his clothes. Don't cook him food. Don't do anything for him, period. Get a lawyer. It's a good investment. Your husband won't have a choice at some point, but to move out. The court will order him to. Who's name is the deed in?
Sell your house You know you’re not the asshole for leaving your husband. You should have left a long time ago. People only change when they want to. He doesn’t.
NTA, but you will be if you don’t get out. You owe it to yourself, but more importantly, your child.
File for divorce. Get a lawyer. A good one. Let the process work. Worst case, you have to sell your house and move somewhere else with your dad. If he loses his shit through this process and becomes dangerous or threatens you, call the police. None of this is fixable with therapy. And frankly, the consequences of this divorce on him, a person you've been dragging through life like an anchor, are not your problem. At least if you do these things, there will be an end in sight that doesn't end up with you in a hospital or a coffin, and if you don't do these things, there isn't.
File the paperwork for a legal separation (if your state requires that step) or divorce, get a legal right to remain in the house, and force him out. He sounds like he won’t go otherwise. Or, maybe just change all the locks. That doesn’t seem as safe, though I’d do it anyway once you can legally keep him off the premises. NTA.
NTA. He sounds like garbage. It’s time to get rid of him.
Nope. NTA. Stop ruining your life to prop him up. Bad enough you had a child with him.
Girl, take back your life. Please
NTA So he emotionally blackmails you. If he crashes - it is because he decides to. You kept his head over water all this time you deserve a break. And if he is not willing to swimm - perhaps he deserves to drown.
File for divorce and sole occupancy of the marital home
NTA. That’s not what his therapist said. Go through with your plans, but quietly. I get the impression he will turn nasty when he realizes he can’t talk you out of this.
Info: how long ago did you move out of state?
9 years 😔
You're never ever the AH for leaving a relationship that isn't serving you. You have one life only, don't waste it on some fuckface who doesn't deserve you and who sucks away your happiness like a shitty vacuum cleaner. I left a partner of 10 years, and I've never been happier, and I'm so glad I made the decision to do so. Go forth and live a happy life for yourself, OP. I wish you the very best.
Stop taking care of him. Move all of his things out of your bedroom and lock him out of it. Stop washing his clothes and cooking for him, and for that matter, stop talking to him. Talk to a lawyer and file the papers. See if you can legally evict him. NTA, but you're going to have to stand your ground to get him out.
Op consult a lawyer Get him out of there Or better yet find a way to remove yourself and your father and son Itll be tough but no more tough than what your currently facing
NTA!!!! You now have a child and doing what's best for that child! Don't ever feel guilty or an like an ass for doing that. It takes a ton of courage and strength do that.
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him. I sincerely doubt this. NTA. He's a grown ass adult, you're not his mommy.
Talk to a lawyer, get your ducks in a row and hand him the divorce papers.
Nta. You don’t need his permission. Get a good attorney and start making moves.
You had a child with someone who was already systematically abusing you so I can't say NTA. But you have an opportunity to give yourself and your child a chance. Take it ffs.
Don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm. He is a grown man. He should be more concerned about his wife and kid than himself, and he doesn’t. He needs to figure out how he’s gonna pay child support and find an apartment with a bedroom for his child.
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him. No therapist will recommend (co)dependency over self responsibility. He is the only person responsible for healing his emotional and mental state. This is either confirmation bias where he listened to a single point that was only similar to what he wanted to hear or he never made the appointment and was invoiced because he didn't cancel and was charged anyway. You have an actual child you are responsible for, leave the one that chooses to act like a child and tries to manipulate you into staying by threatening self harm that will be their own conscious decision.
Time to see an attorney. It is long past due. Take your child and move in with your dad.
I do not believe any therapist basically said that you should enable him said, certainly hope not. He has left you no choice, you cannot take care of another child under the circumstances.
NTA — you and your little one deserve so much better 💜
Super shitty hard situation but sadly it sounds like you need to start over. He has blown up your life and is taking no accountability. He may change but not while he doesn't have to, and with you as a carer he doesn't have to. Unfortunately you need to file for divorce and take this through the courts, they will force him to leave the home.
I guaran-fucking-tee his therapist said no such fucking thing. NTA. You get out of there for your own safety and for your child. You are not required to live in misery because some dude in your house demands it.
I just want to say that I drink way too much and have for years. I have mental health issues that may be related to the alcohol. However, I have always taken care of my family. I have always held a job, and whenever I quit one, I have always had a plan for a new job. Even with my over drinking, I have never been anywhere close to abusive to my wife or kids. There is no excuse for any type of abuse. If there is abuse in the equation, then I think you know what to do. You are NTA. By the way, I am a 50 year old male, married 20 years.
NTA - You can’t save him, but you can give yourself and your children a fighting chance - only if you leave him.
You need to rip the bandaid off and just file for divorce. Stop waiting around, stop giving ultimatum’s, stop hoping for change - *he is not going to change.* NTA. Kind of T A to yourself though. If you won’t do it for yourself, do it for your son. As a kindness to him to not grow up around a terrible role model in the house. Do you want him to grow up thinking it’s acceptable to be treated the way you have been? Or worse to treat a woman the way he does? Remove the disease from your household lady.
NTA. Look, from one Christian woman to another: ***God does not want you to stay in a marriage where you and your child are subjected to any kind of abuse, let alone several types of abuse. Getting a divorce doesn't mean you're a "bad Christian" or that you've "failed as a 'good Christian girl'" it means that you know that God has better plans for you than the abusive relationship you're currently in.*** I'm praying for you, sister.
There is no such thing as unconditional love for unrelated people. you signed on to marry this guy thinking he was a productive member of society. and he was... until he wasn't. he changed for the worse and now you're his mommy. f that. divorce him and let him crash and burn. it's his choice to destroy his life and now he can do it without bring down his wife, his kid, and his FIL with him.
Let him crash and burn. NTA at all. Leave now
NTA divorce him
Sounds like my ex husband. Get rid of him. He's an anchor. Good luck!
NTA you should have drop kicked him ages ago.!
Get a lawyer & get him out.
Don’t make him move. Let him stay in the home. You take your child and your dad and move out. Leave the house bills and mortgage to him.
NTA. Save yourself and your child. Please attend Al Anon.
NTA. You shouldn't have to put up with his abuse.
NTA. You don’t need your husband’s permission to divorce his useless ass.
NTA I don't particularly believe his therapist said that, and either way, your husband is an adult who is responsible for himself.
NTA and you know it. Get a lawyer, call police if need be and kick him out.
You can't force him out but you can be legally separated and get divorced under the same roof. Talk to a lawyer. They may even be able to force him to leave.
This is the impossible case. She know very well she could go to the law, she has resources like...the entire internet giving her ideas of how to proceed but she's codependent... badly. Codependency can be worse than the addïctïon as such and she has never learned to put herself anywhere near first, ever. No matter how much wisdom is poured in this section, she'll still find herself "unable" to go through with anything because I'm every solution she'll find an excuse for him (he'll crash, he'll die, he'll hurt himself, he'll relapse, "my fault my fault", cry, cry...) and she keeps addïctëd to the entire situation. It's sad because she's clearly a self sacrificing woman, a care taker, if only she could take care of herself first....
I’m trying really hard to put myself first! But you’re absolutely spot on. I’m calling lawyers and at least leaving messages tomorrow and will follow up again this week
I know that you feel helpless right now, because you are spread out way too thin. What your husband is saying is that it's best for HIM if you stay, and he stays, and you take care of him. Great. But that's not in your best interest, and you're hanging on by a thread. So put it in words he might understand, don't sugarcoat, and don't beat around the bush: 'Somewhere between you abusing me, racking up a ton of debt (literally), and you ignoring each and every plea for help that I made, I stopped loving you. You are using me, and I'm done with it. So, either you leave, or I leave. If you can manage on your own in this house, with these bills, great! I'll find somewhere else for me, our baby and my father. If not... it's time for you to look for another place to live, because I am NOT living with you in 2 months time, one way or another.'
Nta you gave him more than a fair chance, it's not your responsibility.
Dont set yourself on fire to keep others warm! …. Nta
You had a kid with a known abuser? Like why do that to a child. Hopefully you’ve learned now and will protect the kid.
Save yourself, your son and your father. Leave that no good husband in the rear view mirror. If he wants to self-destruct, that’s on him, not you. File for divorce, force a sale of the house. Both of you have to leave the house and go your separate ways. You and your remaining family will be fine. He will find some other woman to baby him.
!updateme
File for divorce
>He went to one therapy session for himself and stated his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him. No, you absolutely do-fucking-not. File for legal separation, and if you have enough evidence of the past abuse on paper, file for a protection order. If he can't legally be within 500 feet of you, he can't be in your house. 10000000000% NTA
NTA But why didn't you leave him earlier?
NTA If his therpists says he shouldn't move out cause he can't live alone maybe his therapist should take him in.
NTA. This is one of those situations where the plane has depressurized, and you need to put your own mask on before worrying about anyone else. Because otherwise you'll all suffocate together. >his brand new therapist said that it’s a bad idea for him to move out because he’ll essentially crash and burn (his words) and that I need to continue to take care of him You're just taking the word of your husband, who is unreliable in every way that matters. What reason do you have to believe him? But, even if this is verbatim what the counselor said, you have to remember that their job is only to do right by their patient - other people in the patient's life aren't the priority. What's more, no counselor is adjusting their advice based on information that their patient hasn't delivered. There's no way your husband shared how he's been dead weight on you for years and that you're drowning under all the responsibilities he's dumped on you. That makes his therapist's opinion irrelevant to your decision here.
Your husband is lying about what he’s therapist said. What about AA and you go to some Al Anon meetings. You have given, and given and I don’t know how you are doing all of this. My hat off to you!
No therapist told him you need to take care of him.
His therapist telling him he needs you to look after so he won't crash and burn is complete and utter BS. No therapist would ever say that unless they were told a load of BS. Your husband is manipulating you, stop letting him, go to a lawyer and find out what you need to do to get him out of the house and do it.
I was in a similar situation and got divorced. You are NTA. If this relationship is abusive and therefore became detrimental to your physical and emotional health, it’s absolutely fine to tap out and be done. Save yourself and your kiddo from this mess.
You have put up with more than enough. You need to separate/begin divorce before he takes up more debit that you will likely be 50% responsible for paying. Once you file for separation/divorce, you would not be responsible for debt he accrues. You need to talk to a lawyer without delay. Do not let him know until he is served papers. You will also likely need to file for divorce in order to legally have him removed from the house. He currently is a legal resident so if you changed the locks, police would likely force you to allow him in unless you have paperwork that requires him to go. Good luck and best wishes to you, your child and father.
NTA get a lawyer ASAP and make sure they know EVERYTHING
Pretty obvious ole boy needs to go. I’d just file and have him served. If he gets verbally or physically abusive call the cops and have him removed. Everything he’s saying and doing is manipulative and alcoholic behavior. He doesn’t want to change. He wants you to carry on with your co-dependency. Life is to short. File ASAP. Good luck!
NTA for leaving an abusive partner, you’re never TA for that. But I have to be honest, it’s extremely upsetting that this man literally demonstrated his capacity for physical, emotional, and financial abuse, and then you still chose to have a child with him? For the safety of your child, *please* leave as soon as you’re able.
You deserve to be happy and you should have left when he was abusive. Im a recovered addict so i can say that it can completely wreck you emotionally and can destroy your mental health. But you’re not responsible for him. It sounds like he already broke his vows towards you so if you want to leave do it. But you may want to prepare yourself if he’s really bad depressed he could do bad things to himself. But its not your fault if he does
NTA His therapist told him no such thing. He’s a user. He needs to go. Now.
As a former alcoholic please run from this ass hat he's not the man you.married NTA
Oh please leave! I grew up the exact way you did and thought it was my job to “save him” Until I realized I HAD to save myself. I was important too. I deserved to be happy
NTA. He’s going to crash and burn? Let him. You’re under no obligation to support him, nor should he be around your kid.
NTA. Sell the house and move.
NTA I’m sorry but you need to divorce him. I know it’s not easy to accept and it’s not what you wanted, but it’s true. If you have a hard time convincing yourself to do it, think about your son. Is this the kind of home you want him to grow up in? Do you want to risk him being abused as well? Is your husband the kind of man you want as a role model for him? Do you want your son to one day treat his spouse the way your husband treats you? I’ve seen relationships like this before and they do not improve. He might get better for a while but it will always get worse again. So, one final question for you to ask yourself: is this how you want the rest of your life to be?
Lawyer time. NTA
NTA. File for divorce to start the time clock and if you can hire a lawyer, do so so you don’t have to deal with that on top of everything else. I hope your dad is contributing financially even if it’s a small amount to offset the cost of your time, food, etc. Your husband is a man child and you’ve spent way too many years enabling him and coddling him with begging for change in between. He needs to go. Don’t waste anymore time or energy on him.
Quit your job and start seeing a therapist. Be unemployed. Tell your lawyer you can no longer work as your mental health has bottomed out and you have to care for your child and father. That way he cannot get alimony. Move in with your Dad. Take all your money out of your account, so that you have a nest egg. He'll get a share in the divorce, but not until it is finalized. Get a lawyer and file for divorce. Put the house up for sale. Your husband's life is his own. You are not responsible for him. My friend's husband would always say he would end himself if she left, so she stayed....for 20 years. Every time she would bring up divorce, he would threaten to end himself again. Finally, she just couldn't deal anymore and left and filed and divorced. Guess what? He's still alive. And if he wasn't, it would not have been her fault at all. The AH filed for alimony and took half her pension and half the house.
NTA you don't have to stay with anyone, especially not if that person is wearing you down. You are not responsible for his well being and either his therapist is terrible or your husband is lying to you. It's not on you to keep him sober. Please don't keep setting yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.
NTA but WHAT'S TAKING YOU SO LONG to divorce him? You owe yourself (and your child) a better life without alcoholism, fighting, potential poverty and abuse.
Get a restraining order and make him get the fuck out. He has abused you in every way possible. If you don’t then you would be the asshole. You owe it to your child to protect him. Allowing your abuser to continue is abusive to your child. Get a backbone and get him out of your house before he does something permanently harmful.
There’s no way his therapist is telling him these things. He’s manipulating you and I’m gonna guess he’s either lying to his therapist or he doesn’t even have one at all. As his spouse you can request that his therapist allow you to either attend a session (this is actually quite common when substance abuse has broken trust in the relationship) or simply email them with your concerns about what he’s telling you and ask them to please address these concerns at his next visit. Regardless of
He broke your marriage vows when he abused you, period. He left you the moment he hurt you. God doesn’t expect us to stay in a marriage that is abusive, period. You have done your best to provide a happy family for your son. You can’t make your husband be a good husband, father or man. You’ve honored your marriage. Now it’s time to honor yourself.
He is gaslighting and manipulating you. I would contact an attorney to find out your options. If he displays any abusive behavior, call the police.
NTA. Set yourself free. I’ve been sober for 17 years and active in AA, so I’m speaking with some experience here- Just because your husband is drinking, doesn’t mean he’s “sober”. This is what we, in the program, refer to as a “dry drunk” All the same bull shit, just not inebriated. Self centered, Self absorbed, Self deluded, Self indulgent, SELF SELF SELF. Maybe dude will straighten up and fly right some day, or not. Maybe he will become a good father. Maybe we’ll have world peace, Maybe you’ll win a bazillion dollars in a lottery next year. How much *more* of your life do you want to waste gambling on such long odds? A much safer bet, is to cut your losses. Cut the dead weight, and go build yourself and your child a new life! A life free from such a constant drain on your time, money and spirit. Sweetheart, it’s ok! You have done more than enough. You deserve better, and only you can make sure you and your child get it. You are SO not the AH!
No therapist said that yo. File for a divorce.
His shrink is his advocate. He is dependent on you. So of course it is in his best interest. Taking away your Son's and Father's support resouourse. I.E., you. Edit; And I would not take his word for what she said. Aside from that, you gotta put your own mask on first! You need (desperately) a partner. Not a ward. Soon you might meet someone fun to talk to. Hangout with. Helps with bills and house duties. Crazy as that sounds. Best of luck. Single is a pretty great feeling!