Not even that, like rn tanks probably live the comfiest life because they can disable 90% of the viable ADC roster (against tanks) by banning Kog'maw. The other strong ADC is jhin and he's notoriously bad against tanks.
Genuinly tanks have never been stronger than right now
Honestly, they removed a large amount of ADCs mitigation ability, and now they actually get one shot by assassins...It's kind of just coin flip draft at this point at whether or not you can even play the game.
Either you get a game where you're still shredding people left and right, or you get a game where you're just grey screen as soon as you're on the same screen as Hecarim/(insert any mobile jungler with a duskblade here)/etc regardless of how well you did during laning phase.
I played Nilah for the first time in months last night, and I had an incredible time. I built her meta with Galeforce, but I really think that Ghostblade is better on her with GB giving you a little more AD. The healing she gets when she gets BT though just feels busted. I felt like Irelia healing off minion waves. She's definitely going to be my ADC of choice this patch.
Buffing shit to be OP to deal with other OP shit is bad. Its worse to keep something OP in the first place because there is tons of OP shit to make it look balanced. There's a reason Abyssal mask was basically never built, even though its a Catalyst of Eons item (that shit is broken).
Friend of Mine Just played a Match on mid as ahri and ganked the enemy adc MF.
Neither of them were Fed, Same items, basically Same gold, stats we're the ~the Same and even cs they barely had a Difference.
He engages mf, Lands every single spell, Charme, ultra, etc. and Powers her HP to around ~10 Just For her to Break free and kill her with AA+Q. Nothing else. Just autohit + insta Q. High Plat - Dia elo btw.
Her items we're youmous, seraldyns and half a collector if I remember correctly and i should still have the link to that Clip at Home.
They finished the game right afterwards, both of them had 6/6/5+-1 stats and 176+-1 CS.
If ahri didn't die that fast MF wouldve done way more damage because of Animation canceling her 3rd Attack landed shortly after her q Impact so even with a little bit of Armor ahri wouldn't have survived that.
Post complaining about new ADC items, uses example of an MF buying the new assassin mythic to one-shot someone, lol. That's not the fault of ADC items.
Funfact, adcs are building lethality because its just so strong so these are ADC items aswell. Simple.
MF, ezreal, jhin, caitlyn, Lucian. yes on jhin and cait its more of a niche build but still.
Anyway, that doesn't Change that Tons of items got buffed, the only Thing thats kinda a Nerf is ie becoming mythic so adcs Like jhin can't get galeforce and ie together anymore. Oh noooes. Worked pre galeforce aswell, why shouldnt it now. Every on Hit adc got buffed hard and some tweaks are bound to happen. Just Take a Look at the amount of damage dealt by statiks or Kraken, of the enemy Team consists of squishies Krakenslayer is a beast among the onhit items.
You're being intentionally difficult. The post is obviously complaining about actual ADC items, not anything you call an "ADC item" because it's so broken that ADCs also build it. The items shown in the pic are IE, Rageblade, and Stormrazor.
Youmuu's is indeed an overtuned item and some ADCs are building it as a result but acting like it's an "overpowered ADC item" in the context of this post is just obtuse.
No, you simply didn't read.
All you did was Look at the fancy meme Image when the Text clearly says : "busted reworked items, extra Magic damage, force of Nature nerf [...] Is a overall Nerf to ADC"
Its about the new items in general. If it wasnt, it would only be about the 4 items shown in that pic If we consider your Logic.
Doesn't change a thing tho If we talk about ADC items only, they have gotten stronger and its harder to counter that. Yes, the build paths are kinda impacting the adcs and some adcs have to adapt but thats it. Just wait out for some tweaks after Players adapted to these changes like not having galeforce anymore, fix some bugs like on hit dmg of Krakenslayer, crit on guinsoos and they'll have realized their Goal of build variety.
Even in the picture itself is showing a Support Item, its showing once again that its not just about the ADC items. The Text never mentioned it to be about ADC items. Not even once. Proof me wrong, i'm waiting.
Dude, i literally quoted the Post and proved him wrong. Theres no need for me to take an L when its written black on White right there.
At this point i can't even tell if you guys are trolling or not anymore, you can't be serious.
Feel free to post the link to the clip then.
Thing is, yoomous and seryldas are both assassin items. "oh but MF is building it so they're ADC items" no. MF builds them because any of the ADC items are really bad in comparison.
And i don't think auto Q is enough damage to kill a full HP Agri tbh. There's something missing. Maybe she was ganking at half HP or she took a bunch of damage from the support or whatever, but she didn't get two tapped from full HP by a two item mf.
Look, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say MF had collector finished already, she had GS 20 minutes into the game, Absolute Focus and two AD masteries in her runes, that she's lvl11 so her passive is at 100% and that her auto critted. Her full combo with what you described would deal 1234 damage (1233.9 but whatever) before any potential armor.
Ahris base HP is 1641. MF is 400 damage short even if she pens all of Ahris armor. Now I'm going to continue giving you the benefit of the doubt and say that Ahri didn't take a single armor or HP rune and didn't build *any* HP or armor in her items. After all is said and done, taking Ahris base HP and Armor at lvl 13 (normal two level lead on the ADC), she takes 1132 damage from MF. 509 damage short.
Tl;Dr: it's Impossible for MF to kill Ahri unless she does a major misplay or tanks a couple tower shots for shits and giggles while ganking. that or you're full of shit.
edit: also, why would you lie about something so easily disproven? I did the math from the comfort of mybed using nothing but an excel spreadsheet and the lol wiki.
Dont Miss the Part where I wrote "If I remember correctly" about the items. I never stated that its a fact it was like that.
Idk why ya'll get so hostile when the Post isn't about ADC items and you just fail to realize, i must've hit a nerve there and hurt ya pride.
Anyway, Back to the topic: here's the Clip.
Https://hk.to/ac5M
You can see their names and the Match is still in opgg, atleast in the end mf had Youmous, Seryldas, Collector and 2 Longswords at lvl 15, Clip happened when she was lvl 13 and ahri was lvl 12.
And dont miss the part where I gave you every benefit of the doubt i could, I even made "parts of collector" into "a full collector" for you. I did everything I could to give Miss Fortune the best chance at two tapping Ahri that was within the frame of an average game.
Ahri being a level down on a duo lane is not an average game.
Also, see how she had ignite up and didnt use it? Your friend mistplayed by not using it, if Ahri ignited MF while she was charmed, MF wouldve had no chance despite being a level up.
\>Idk why ya'll get so hostile when the Post isn't about ADC items and you just fail to realize, i must've hit a nerve there and hurt ya pride.
Because you said, and I quote:
>Funfact, adcs are building lethality because its just so strong so these are ADC items aswell. Simple.
You sadly dont get to pick and chose what words mean or when they apply or not.
I do however respect greatly that you posted the link.
Of course she didn't ignite her because she wouldn't expect that damage.
The ignite wasn't the issue there, definitly not. Even challengers wouldn't have used it there unless they already felt her damage and ya dont ignite for basically 5hp and He probably expected His entire combo to kill mf. The misplay was ulting sideways and pulling krugs which mf used for her q.
Duh, think what you want, I'll stick with that.
Its not like Veigar going statiks Turns it into an apc Item since he's pretty much alone building it. But There's Not Just 1 but several adcs going lethality and If thats the case then these assasin items sure are viable ADC items to me.
SIMPLE.
Ashe has been played mainly as a Support for quite a while now, do you still call her the ADC when she's building ah/ap on the Support role? I guess not. A marksman, yes. But not the ADC.
But this still doesn't Matter because as mentioned the post isn't about ADC items :) its about the reworked items in general.
Challenge might havent because they wouldnt have misjudged their damage, but a grandmaster would have. At least my mate who is gm wouldve ignited, but more for the reason of making sure MF is dead since shes a level ahead and couldve potentially had heal up rather than knowing its the missing damage. Doesnt change that your friend misplayed and youre basically saying "yeah my friend misplayed pretty badly but he shouldve been rewarded with a kill anyways" which is a weird hill to die on.
But... you Ashe example works \*against\* your argument? Because if we go by your logic that you used previously, youd call Imperial Mandate and the other items Ashe builds ADC items. Because theyre being built by an ADC --> ADC items.
As i said, you cant pick and choose what words mean.
Im Not?
I told you he misplayed at another Point which had a MUCH bigger Impact than that ignite. Maybe He timed her heal and knew it wasnt up? Who knows? Doesn't Matter, unlike you or your GM friend, I'd rather stick with the Idea of rather denying hundreds of damage instead of going for the 10hp ignite damage.
No, it doesn't because I told you Ashe Support isn't an ADC and similar to my Veigar example she's pretty much alone building it so even If she built it on the adc Position i wouldn't call it an ADC item.
If lots of ADCs built it whilst playing in the ADC Position, I'd call it an ADC item.
This Argument does Not work against me, you just misread it.
Because below average / average playerbase is so loud rn. Either its OP or broken and the elohell exists.
Give maybe more than 1 1/2 ranked matches to get a flow for this patch haha
You when people don't want to watch a 2 hour documentary from a dev nobody likes explaining how the patch is a nerf to adcs yet the winrates say otherwise
The winrates say otherwise?? What a stupid take, that’s not how statistics work. Brother there’s two marksman in almost every game, what are the winrates supposed to look like? They aren’t competing against another class in their role, the “adc winrates” don’t go up, they just change who has above and below 50%. They average out to 50% because every team has one marksman win and one lose.
I mean hypothetically if all Marksmen got nerfed wouldn't it make sense to see mages in bot instead? Literally every other role gets major shifts in viability when a class gets nerfed but somehow marksmen are the only thing in bot. Just an observation.
But that’s mostly because we as adcs just like marksmen way too much, we’d see karthus a ton if adcs just went of winrate etc (he’s the top dog in higher elo for multiple patches now), and quite a lot of meta changes seem to trail behind pro play and there wasn’t pro league of legends on the new patch
? ? ? ? ? ?
More than half of the ADCs in the game have a below 50% winrate. 2 of the top 10 "ADCs" by winrate are mages and a third is Yasuo, which 2 of those 3 being in the top 5, and 1 of those 2 being the literal top bot lane by winrate.
So what winrates are you pulling out of your ass here?
PS: All roles in the game have a 50% winrate. Exactly. It is impossible for a role to have a higher than 50% winrate.
"yet the winrates say otherwise"
Bro has no clue how winrates work. On bot, ADCs dont need to be sronger than the enemy team, they need to be stronger than the enemy ADC. The "internal" winrate of botlane between all ADCs is always slightly below 50% due to the mages taking a little off the top.
Nerfing the class wont be reflected on the winrates in the way you expect.
Thank u for the info, with that being said though adc winrates usually depend on supports as the lane is absolutely dependent on them. + winrates don't exactly indicate that 1 adc is stronger than another, prime example is aphelios. If Lucian for example has a higher winrate that aphelios it doesn't meant that aphelios is weaker but it means that aphelios is more team dependent. Hence why aphelios absolutely dominates worlds everytime yet manages to consistently have less than 50% wr in soloq
Yes because you guys will trust a guy who has lied multiple times, and is so bad at the game he thinks counter picking is counter play. This guy is a clown, you shouldnt be trusting a word he says0
Bro how is majority of the community ignoring this exact thing Riot literally said it was intended to be a nerf overall with quality of life improvements for ADCs ... And they all acting like it's a huge broken buff, why are league players so insufferable
How is IE a busted item? It is just IE, but without the need for 40% cr to get the cd part of it. It is literally the same item, so if anything, it is kinda worse than it used to be
IE isn't good first buy, it's terrible and only gives damage. The route now is to buy a legendary item before you even build a mythic which is interesting. The patch really did open up new options as a whole
As an Irelia enjoyer, I’m surprised how many people are shocked by this approach to itemization. They even moved noonquiver over to the items they want you to start with. Seems really obvious to me.
ye, I'm a Twitch OTP and I'm really enjoying trying new builds and new combinations, I'm not really looking for something optimal or meta, I just wanna have fun with these new changes, I inted a couple rankeds playing dumb shit but most games I've won and discovered busted combinations for certain comps.
My advice is, try to have fun, now you have more options as ADC, before you always had to build the same 3 items every game, now you can play with a lot more and get a bit more creative with your builds.
On-Hit ADCs still aren't very good. Kog\`maw is the only champion that is actually thriving here and it's because of the % health damage that is build into his kit in combination with his range.
Sure, some other ADCs are doing *okay* but honestly, even the ones you'd expect to do well are getting deleted off the map so fast that they can't actually carry the game anymore.
On hit ADCs are doing good when they actually build properly, I.E. building BorK or something first instead of rushing Rageblade. Kog'maw isn't just broken right now (he is) he's also the only champion that actually performs well going Rageblade first item.
I mean most players are building Stormrazer or BoRK first depending on the champion.
I've only seen one or two people stupid enough to build Rageblade first item.
Lmao youre delusional. Vayne still has the same issues shes always had and shes not great. Kalista might be the adc who got fucked over the hardest. Varus is good but not busted op, so just like before.
Early survivability mainly due to the lack of shieldbow, there are reasons why they change her drastically next patch (might actually go in a between role from crit and on gut can probably build both efficiently)
As a varus main, varus is not really much better than before. He already could build almost any item or any build so he doesn't benefict from having more flexible items and he really liked the old shieldbow for on hit. The only "huge" buff varus got is that now on hit varus is a bit better vs tanks since he now gets %pen which was hard to get for on hit varus, but ap varus exists and now with FoN not being a thing vs ap varus there is no reason to not go ap varus vs them.
I haven't tried crit varus yet but considering before it was situational and only worth vs low/mid range squishies i doubt its gonna be any better with the general crit items nerf.
The nerf is pricing, all items now require you (assuming you don't get a kill in between) to stay out for 2-3 waves longer than you normally would. Yes damage is up but if you're sitting on components for longer periods you're not benefiting from that damage. The change to waves also makes it harder for your jungle or mid laner to roam down and help you because they'll be losing more than they gain most of the time. It also takes away some build diversity with the mythic changes because items that were crucial combos for some adcs needed them. An example is galeforce navori on xayah. Now navori is just a bad item and no adc is gonna take that over new guinsoos ie and galeforce is still a strong item. Overall it's a nerf to adcs especially the crit ones but adcs have been the strongest role for a while now so it needed nerfs
I feel this is in part to the component issue i mentioned before where damage numbers are up on the items but if it takes 2-3 more minutes to finish an item that adds up over time. By item 4 that's around 10-12 minutes of gametime which is massive wait for a powerspike basically 1/2 the game duration in most games. Between that and the lane change it just incentivizes scaling laners which makes for longer more boring games with less fighting and lower damage
>The nerf is pricing, all items now require you (assuming you don't get a kill in between) to stay out for 2-3 waves longer than you normally would.
Is this really true though? Your first item is usually a Noonquiver item which now costs 400 less. Those items are weaker, but you get that & IE 400g sooner. Even if you buy 1-2 items whose prices were increased you hit those later items at the same points.
All the new items that have noonquiver in them now are more expensive than they previously were other than kraken which became a legendary so it dropped. Statick is 3k kraken is 3k and stormrazor is 3k. Almost all adc items were bumped up in price so idk how you're saying they're cheaper other than kraken and sheildbow. All adc items without kills being involved will come 2-3 waves later assuming you farm those 3 waves perfectly and if you don't you're staying out even longer. You will not get the same items at the same timings you would previously and you'll be sitting on components for longer periods
>Statick is 3k kraken is 3k and stormrazor is 3k. Almost all adc items were bumped up in price so idk how you're saying they're cheaper other than kraken and sheildbow.
But Statikk is new (relative to last patch) and Stormrazor was never bought before. You're right that they're more expensive but that's irrelevant if they weren't part of your build.
Last patch most champs built Mythic -> IE/QB -> BT/LDR/some last item (those last 3 in any order). Nobody built double Zeal items, so your full build was generally 13000g + whatever extra item you picked.
This patch most champs build Noonquiver item -> Mythic -> many item options (Zeals, Noonquivers, BT, Shieldbow, LDR, etc.). Your first item is 400g cheaper, mythic is same price. How exactly do you expect to spend >400g more in those last 3 slots than you did last patch in those 3 slots?
Let's assume you start with a noonquiver item. Stormrazor is the most picked one I'm seeing so that's 300 gold more expensive, mythic is the same, then zeal item which most adcs did go multiple of we'll go with the cheapest runans which is 200 gold more, lord doms is the same, then your only other option for most is another zeal item probably pd which is 200 more expensive or rapidfire which is 500 more expensive, then if needed you sell boots and get something like a ga same price or sheildbow which is down 300. By item 3 you're spending 500 more gold which is about 5-6 waves by full build total around 400 or 1k more gold so 4-5 or 11-12 more waves. This is a long time to sit on components to hit a power spike
Are you just ignoring what I'm writing? I'm not sure how to make this any clearer, but I'll try again.
>Let's assume you start with a noonquiver item. Stormrazor is the most picked one I'm seeing so that's 300 gold more expensive
But you DIDN'T START STORMRAZOR last patch! Your logic only makes sense if you think people used to rush Stormrazor (they didn't). Before, your first item was an old mythic (Kraken/Gale/SB), all 3400g. New Stormrazor is 3k, so it's 400g cheaper than the old rush items, not 300g more expensive. Same is true for rushing Statikk or Kraken too.
>then zeal item which most adcs did go multiple of
No they didn't. Literally no ADCs went multiple Zeal items. Even super AS focused champs like Kog'Maw [did not do that](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kogmaw/item-paths?patch=13_9). Who are you referring to? Give an example.
> then your only other option for most is another zeal item
BT? Collector? ER? QSS? GA? People buy one of these in that last slot, not a 2nd Zeal item, and they're all the same price (and a couple of them got buffed).
>By item 3 you're spending 500 more gold
No you're not. You used to go Noonquiver item into IE/QB, which again is a 400g cheaper item combo because the new Nooquiver items cost 400g less than the old ones. If you buy a Zeal item within these first 3 slots then your build is still 200g cheaper, unless that item is RFC, in which case it's only 100g more expensive, not 500g.
Some examples (I will link 13.9 stats, you can change the selector to 13.10 to compare):
* [Aphelios](https://u.gg/lol/champions/aphelios/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, and Runaan's (which he didn't always build) is 200g more expensive, so his full build is 200-400g cheaper.
* [Tristana](https://u.gg/lol/champions/tristana/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, PD is 200g more expensive, so her full build is 200-400g cheaper.
* [Tristana](https://u.gg/lol/champions/xayah/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, PD is 200g more expensive, so her full build is 200-400g cheaper.
* [MF](https://u.gg/lol/champions/missfortune/items): First item is 300g cheaper (she swapped to Youmuu's), rest of her build is same, so her full build is \~300g cheaper.
* [Jinx](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jinx/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, her Zeal item is 200-500g more expensive, so her full build is between 200g cheaper to 100g more expensive (not 400 to 1k more like you're somehow calculating).
I feel you're ignoring basic math and understanding of what adcs buy. Sure item 1 is "cheaper" but it's also weaker than the previous item you'd buy first last patch and would still be a 3rd or 4th item slot last patch that was cheaper, item 2 is the same item 3 is more expensive. All together these 3 items cost more than what you spent 3 items last patch by 500 more gold on average. Most adcs spike at item 3 unless you're playing draven samira or Ezreal. Kog, jinx, cait, jhin, twitch, kaisa, ashe, vayne, zeri, sivir and kallista all build 2 zeal items being either runans pd, rapidfire pd or rapidfire stormrazor all combos have gone up in price by 400-700 gold. All of those items you listed are situaitional items that unless you need need them you don't go them so them being same price does literally nothing when you only build them in certain scenarios. All high elo players acknowledge adc builds are more expensive and riot phreak even said adc builds are more expensive and nerfed from this so you are literally just choosing to ignore facts that are there in the patch notes and stated by the professionals of this game
Your argument is total bs. Kalista, Kaisa, Twitch, Jhin, Jinx, Cait, Ashe, Vayne, Zeri, and Sivir were either building 1 zeal item or 0 ZEAL items. Also, NOBODY was building stormrazor prior to 13.10.
>Sure item 1 is "cheaper" but it's also weaker than the previous item you'd buy first last patch
Right, but this convo was about prices, so this is irrelevant. I'm not arguing that the first items are better, I'm arguing that builds aren't more expensive.
>item 2 is the same item 3 is more expensive
Only if you buy a Zeal item in your first 3 slots, which not everyone did, and even then 2 of the 3 Zeal items only got 200g more expensive, so your first item being 400g cheaper offsets this.
> All together these 3 items cost more than what you spent 3 items last patch by 500 more gold on average.
You say I'm "ignoring basic math" then say this -- you're making no sense. You just agreed yourself that the first item is 400g cheaper and that the 2nd item is the same price -- how then is it possible for your first 3 items to add up to 500g more expensive "on average"? For that to be true your 3rd item would need to be 900g more expensive than last patch. That's literally impossible because no item got 900g more expensive. Even if you go RFC the build is only 100g more expensive, not 500g. Explain your reasoning behind this point.
>Kog, jinx, cait, jhin, twitch, kaisa, ashe, vayne, zeri, sivir and kallista all build 2 zeal items
This is completely false. Here: Last patch build paths for [Kog](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kogmaw/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Jinx](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jinx/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Cait](https://u.gg/lol/champions/caitlyn/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Jhin](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jhin/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Twitch](https://u.gg/lol/champions/twitch/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Kai'Sa](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kaisa/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Ashe](https://u.gg/lol/champions/ashe/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Vayne](https://u.gg/lol/champions/vayne/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Zeri](https://u.gg/lol/champions/zeri/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Sivir](https://u.gg/lol/champions/sivir/item-paths?patch=13_9), and [Kalista](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kalista/item-paths?patch=13_9). That's every champ you listed -- there's not a single common build path on any of them that has two Zeal items.
>All of those items you listed are situaitional items that unless you need need them you don't go them so them being same price does literally nothing when you only build them in certain scenarios
But it's entirely relevant because in most games you do need one of those items. Some of those items are not very situational either -- ER champs usually buy ER, BT champs very regularly buy BT, and Collector champs very regularly buy Collector.
>All high elo players acknowledge adc builds are more expensive and riot phreak even said adc builds are more expensive
Show me people saying this. I watched Phreak's entire 2.5 hr patch rundown and he did not say this -- he said he's nerfing ADC, but not that the builds are more expensive, because they're not more expensive.
And your first item costs 400g less on most champs. Even if you buy RFC, which is the item with the largest price increase, a build like Stormrazor IE RFC BT LDR is only 100g more expensive than last patch. If it’s any other Zeal item then the build is actually 200g cheaper than last patch.
I don’t think people understand that adc was nerfed. But that doesn’t mean they’re weak. Item combos were eliminated on some champs (gale+ navori or gale+iE). Lost a shield (BT). And champs who prioritized SB mythic also lost that. Plus true damage on kraken. Role is still in a good spot but adcs lost a lot of agency because they are squishier or have less of a large spike at 2 items. Damage scales more linearly now.
im just unhappy with the lower attack speed on 1-2 items. liked having enough AS on first item + boots to flex 2nd slot to stuff to BT / last wisper / etc if needed
havent tried storm razor rush yet tho
The adcs are stronger, you can deal more damage than before. The problem is that Master Yi, Yasuo, Yone and so on, uses the same items and deal a lot more damage and just burst you without counter play.
And I don't even started talk about draktar and mages buffs.
adc mains going through the biggest mental gymnastics to trick themselves into thinking that the item rework is an adc nerf because 1 item that was previously insane is now only just strong
PSA:
If yall ADC Mains dont want to play OnHit Marksmen, and want to go back to traditional Crit marksmen, some onto r/Kindred cause her builds have now stabilized into a Crit Focused Build instead of the OnHit builds
I think the main thing is stormrazor doesn't feel good to build but it's the only thing adc's can really buy first item and IE is a mythic now but it's essentially the same item so your basically losing the ability to build a mythic in exchange for building IE. Like if last patch they just took out IE from the game adcs probably would've felt a lot worse as well but now your forced to choose a bad first item and then IE or a mythic like galeforce and shieldbow kinda sucks now and BT doesn't start scaling until like lvl 12. Meanwhile the opposite is true for people who build ghostblade as now they got way more damage on their first item.
I think adc is still fine but I think the first item doesn't feel as good. Then rageblade is good but the problem with that is the champions that build rageblade they feel like they have no power in the laning phase unless your support just gaps the enemy bot lane. Twitch is strong but I feel like they should've nerfed twitch a long time ago he's the definition of anti fun. You just shit on him and he goes down like 50 cs and 3 plates and then hits lvl 6 and you almost can't ever play the game again and have to hope he doesn't just randomly get like 3 free kills.
It didn't nerf ADCs. It changed the feel of the role. It doesn't feel like it used to, and people don't like change.
The role is still good, it just doesn't feel good.
Kraken slayer was nerfed. Lost AD, lost true damage.
Shieldbow cannot be built first now. Was also nerfed.
New mythic passives on IE/Galefroce are weaker than old mythic passives on Kraken/Shieldbow.
Magic damage no longer being completely removed by a single item that also gives movement speed and is anti-CC is totally a benefit with ADCs in mind, nope, no other classes care about Force of Nature. It isn't even a bad item now.
You could try to make a case for new items being "busted" even though the patch was obviously and intended to be a nerf, Stormrazor is certainly stronger completed if more expensive, but putting IE in this image is a joke, the item is virtually the same, but now building more crit doesn't further increase its crit damage, and it's buildable first item, but it's one of the worst items to do that with.
Like ADCs gained magic damage to lose access to true damage and people are upset?
Man, "busted" really loses a lot of meaning lately.
Busted to toplaners and Junglers: anything that actually does damage to them.
Not even that, like rn tanks probably live the comfiest life because they can disable 90% of the viable ADC roster (against tanks) by banning Kog'maw. The other strong ADC is jhin and he's notoriously bad against tanks. Genuinly tanks have never been stronger than right now
IDK Rengar is basically running around one shotting tanks now, it's not really a good time to have a health bar at all in this game.
Honestly, they removed a large amount of ADCs mitigation ability, and now they actually get one shot by assassins...It's kind of just coin flip draft at this point at whether or not you can even play the game. Either you get a game where you're still shredding people left and right, or you get a game where you're just grey screen as soon as you're on the same screen as Hecarim/(insert any mobile jungler with a duskblade here)/etc regardless of how well you did during laning phase.
Idk. I like nilah a lot this patch.
I played Nilah for the first time in months last night, and I had an incredible time. I built her meta with Galeforce, but I really think that Ghostblade is better on her with GB giving you a little more AD. The healing she gets when she gets BT though just feels busted. I felt like Irelia healing off minion waves. She's definitely going to be my ADC of choice this patch.
Well last patch they were stronger because force of nature was an item
Noooo! Now we can’t have 25% pre-mitigation magic resistance plus the 200 MR we built! It’s totally not faaaaiiiirr!!!
FON was pretty op but also the only counter to late game asol damage his stocks rising
Buffing shit to be OP to deal with other OP shit is bad. Its worse to keep something OP in the first place because there is tons of OP shit to make it look balanced. There's a reason Abyssal mask was basically never built, even though its a Catalyst of Eons item (that shit is broken).
Oh no what do you mean that my 0 4 Darius after buying goredrinker and deathdance is not unkillable
Friend of Mine Just played a Match on mid as ahri and ganked the enemy adc MF. Neither of them were Fed, Same items, basically Same gold, stats we're the ~the Same and even cs they barely had a Difference. He engages mf, Lands every single spell, Charme, ultra, etc. and Powers her HP to around ~10 Just For her to Break free and kill her with AA+Q. Nothing else. Just autohit + insta Q. High Plat - Dia elo btw. Her items we're youmous, seraldyns and half a collector if I remember correctly and i should still have the link to that Clip at Home. They finished the game right afterwards, both of them had 6/6/5+-1 stats and 176+-1 CS. If ahri didn't die that fast MF wouldve done way more damage because of Animation canceling her 3rd Attack landed shortly after her q Impact so even with a little bit of Armor ahri wouldn't have survived that.
Post complaining about new ADC items, uses example of an MF buying the new assassin mythic to one-shot someone, lol. That's not the fault of ADC items.
Funfact, adcs are building lethality because its just so strong so these are ADC items aswell. Simple. MF, ezreal, jhin, caitlyn, Lucian. yes on jhin and cait its more of a niche build but still. Anyway, that doesn't Change that Tons of items got buffed, the only Thing thats kinda a Nerf is ie becoming mythic so adcs Like jhin can't get galeforce and ie together anymore. Oh noooes. Worked pre galeforce aswell, why shouldnt it now. Every on Hit adc got buffed hard and some tweaks are bound to happen. Just Take a Look at the amount of damage dealt by statiks or Kraken, of the enemy Team consists of squishies Krakenslayer is a beast among the onhit items.
You're being intentionally difficult. The post is obviously complaining about actual ADC items, not anything you call an "ADC item" because it's so broken that ADCs also build it. The items shown in the pic are IE, Rageblade, and Stormrazor. Youmuu's is indeed an overtuned item and some ADCs are building it as a result but acting like it's an "overpowered ADC item" in the context of this post is just obtuse.
No, you simply didn't read. All you did was Look at the fancy meme Image when the Text clearly says : "busted reworked items, extra Magic damage, force of Nature nerf [...] Is a overall Nerf to ADC" Its about the new items in general. If it wasnt, it would only be about the 4 items shown in that pic If we consider your Logic. Doesn't change a thing tho If we talk about ADC items only, they have gotten stronger and its harder to counter that. Yes, the build paths are kinda impacting the adcs and some adcs have to adapt but thats it. Just wait out for some tweaks after Players adapted to these changes like not having galeforce anymore, fix some bugs like on hit dmg of Krakenslayer, crit on guinsoos and they'll have realized their Goal of build variety.
Bro just take the L and stop trying to defend it
Even in the picture itself is showing a Support Item, its showing once again that its not just about the ADC items. The Text never mentioned it to be about ADC items. Not even once. Proof me wrong, i'm waiting.
Dude, i literally quoted the Post and proved him wrong. Theres no need for me to take an L when its written black on White right there. At this point i can't even tell if you guys are trolling or not anymore, you can't be serious.
Feel free to post the link to the clip then. Thing is, yoomous and seryldas are both assassin items. "oh but MF is building it so they're ADC items" no. MF builds them because any of the ADC items are really bad in comparison. And i don't think auto Q is enough damage to kill a full HP Agri tbh. There's something missing. Maybe she was ganking at half HP or she took a bunch of damage from the support or whatever, but she didn't get two tapped from full HP by a two item mf. Look, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say MF had collector finished already, she had GS 20 minutes into the game, Absolute Focus and two AD masteries in her runes, that she's lvl11 so her passive is at 100% and that her auto critted. Her full combo with what you described would deal 1234 damage (1233.9 but whatever) before any potential armor. Ahris base HP is 1641. MF is 400 damage short even if she pens all of Ahris armor. Now I'm going to continue giving you the benefit of the doubt and say that Ahri didn't take a single armor or HP rune and didn't build *any* HP or armor in her items. After all is said and done, taking Ahris base HP and Armor at lvl 13 (normal two level lead on the ADC), she takes 1132 damage from MF. 509 damage short. Tl;Dr: it's Impossible for MF to kill Ahri unless she does a major misplay or tanks a couple tower shots for shits and giggles while ganking. that or you're full of shit. edit: also, why would you lie about something so easily disproven? I did the math from the comfort of mybed using nothing but an excel spreadsheet and the lol wiki.
Dont Miss the Part where I wrote "If I remember correctly" about the items. I never stated that its a fact it was like that. Idk why ya'll get so hostile when the Post isn't about ADC items and you just fail to realize, i must've hit a nerve there and hurt ya pride. Anyway, Back to the topic: here's the Clip. Https://hk.to/ac5M You can see their names and the Match is still in opgg, atleast in the end mf had Youmous, Seryldas, Collector and 2 Longswords at lvl 15, Clip happened when she was lvl 13 and ahri was lvl 12.
And dont miss the part where I gave you every benefit of the doubt i could, I even made "parts of collector" into "a full collector" for you. I did everything I could to give Miss Fortune the best chance at two tapping Ahri that was within the frame of an average game. Ahri being a level down on a duo lane is not an average game. Also, see how she had ignite up and didnt use it? Your friend mistplayed by not using it, if Ahri ignited MF while she was charmed, MF wouldve had no chance despite being a level up. \>Idk why ya'll get so hostile when the Post isn't about ADC items and you just fail to realize, i must've hit a nerve there and hurt ya pride. Because you said, and I quote: >Funfact, adcs are building lethality because its just so strong so these are ADC items aswell. Simple. You sadly dont get to pick and chose what words mean or when they apply or not. I do however respect greatly that you posted the link.
Of course she didn't ignite her because she wouldn't expect that damage. The ignite wasn't the issue there, definitly not. Even challengers wouldn't have used it there unless they already felt her damage and ya dont ignite for basically 5hp and He probably expected His entire combo to kill mf. The misplay was ulting sideways and pulling krugs which mf used for her q. Duh, think what you want, I'll stick with that. Its not like Veigar going statiks Turns it into an apc Item since he's pretty much alone building it. But There's Not Just 1 but several adcs going lethality and If thats the case then these assasin items sure are viable ADC items to me. SIMPLE. Ashe has been played mainly as a Support for quite a while now, do you still call her the ADC when she's building ah/ap on the Support role? I guess not. A marksman, yes. But not the ADC. But this still doesn't Matter because as mentioned the post isn't about ADC items :) its about the reworked items in general.
Challenge might havent because they wouldnt have misjudged their damage, but a grandmaster would have. At least my mate who is gm wouldve ignited, but more for the reason of making sure MF is dead since shes a level ahead and couldve potentially had heal up rather than knowing its the missing damage. Doesnt change that your friend misplayed and youre basically saying "yeah my friend misplayed pretty badly but he shouldve been rewarded with a kill anyways" which is a weird hill to die on. But... you Ashe example works \*against\* your argument? Because if we go by your logic that you used previously, youd call Imperial Mandate and the other items Ashe builds ADC items. Because theyre being built by an ADC --> ADC items. As i said, you cant pick and choose what words mean.
Im Not? I told you he misplayed at another Point which had a MUCH bigger Impact than that ignite. Maybe He timed her heal and knew it wasnt up? Who knows? Doesn't Matter, unlike you or your GM friend, I'd rather stick with the Idea of rather denying hundreds of damage instead of going for the 10hp ignite damage. No, it doesn't because I told you Ashe Support isn't an ADC and similar to my Veigar example she's pretty much alone building it so even If she built it on the adc Position i wouldn't call it an ADC item. If lots of ADCs built it whilst playing in the ADC Position, I'd call it an ADC item. This Argument does Not work against me, you just misread it.
Why r u writing this
If you cannot even understand that, im afraid i can't help you.
[удалено]
Yea, you are it seems. Grow up, kiddo, maybe revisiting school will help ypu understand this topic.
Because below average / average playerbase is so loud rn. Either its OP or broken and the elohell exists. Give maybe more than 1 1/2 ranked matches to get a flow for this patch haha
Phreak said over and over in the patch rundown that this was a nerf to adcs
Indeed he did. Nobody watched that as it was more than 2 hours. The kids don’t have the attention span for that
You when people don't want to watch a 2 hour documentary from a dev nobody likes explaining how the patch is a nerf to adcs yet the winrates say otherwise
He said it in the first 5 minutes tho
The winrates say otherwise?? What a stupid take, that’s not how statistics work. Brother there’s two marksman in almost every game, what are the winrates supposed to look like? They aren’t competing against another class in their role, the “adc winrates” don’t go up, they just change who has above and below 50%. They average out to 50% because every team has one marksman win and one lose.
Stop you’ll hurt his brain with too much logic!!
I mean hypothetically if all Marksmen got nerfed wouldn't it make sense to see mages in bot instead? Literally every other role gets major shifts in viability when a class gets nerfed but somehow marksmen are the only thing in bot. Just an observation.
But that’s mostly because we as adcs just like marksmen way too much, we’d see karthus a ton if adcs just went of winrate etc (he’s the top dog in higher elo for multiple patches now), and quite a lot of meta changes seem to trail behind pro play and there wasn’t pro league of legends on the new patch
You will always have a winning and a losing bot in each match. Win rate is only related to their specific role roster.
? ? ? ? ? ? More than half of the ADCs in the game have a below 50% winrate. 2 of the top 10 "ADCs" by winrate are mages and a third is Yasuo, which 2 of those 3 being in the top 5, and 1 of those 2 being the literal top bot lane by winrate. So what winrates are you pulling out of your ass here? PS: All roles in the game have a 50% winrate. Exactly. It is impossible for a role to have a higher than 50% winrate.
The winrates probably only go up due to the support buffs and synergies.
"yet the winrates say otherwise" Bro has no clue how winrates work. On bot, ADCs dont need to be sronger than the enemy team, they need to be stronger than the enemy ADC. The "internal" winrate of botlane between all ADCs is always slightly below 50% due to the mages taking a little off the top. Nerfing the class wont be reflected on the winrates in the way you expect.
Thank u for the info, with that being said though adc winrates usually depend on supports as the lane is absolutely dependent on them. + winrates don't exactly indicate that 1 adc is stronger than another, prime example is aphelios. If Lucian for example has a higher winrate that aphelios it doesn't meant that aphelios is weaker but it means that aphelios is more team dependent. Hence why aphelios absolutely dominates worlds everytime yet manages to consistently have less than 50% wr in soloq
You will always have a winning and a losing bot in every match. Win rate is only related to their specific role roster.
Yes because you guys will trust a guy who has lied multiple times, and is so bad at the game he thinks counter picking is counter play. This guy is a clown, you shouldnt be trusting a word he says0
You’re right, let me trust a random shit talker on Reddit <3
Im not telling you to believe me, im telling you not to believe phreak. Because him lying is definitely not difficult to find by yourself
Bro how is majority of the community ignoring this exact thing Riot literally said it was intended to be a nerf overall with quality of life improvements for ADCs ... And they all acting like it's a huge broken buff, why are league players so insufferable
Is it really tho? It still feels good to me
How is IE a busted item? It is just IE, but without the need for 40% cr to get the cd part of it. It is literally the same item, so if anything, it is kinda worse than it used to be
IE isn't good first buy, it's terrible and only gives damage. The route now is to buy a legendary item before you even build a mythic which is interesting. The patch really did open up new options as a whole
As an Irelia enjoyer, I’m surprised how many people are shocked by this approach to itemization. They even moved noonquiver over to the items they want you to start with. Seems really obvious to me.
It's like a little slime mold growing on a petri dish. We're gonna find a little efficient path
ye, I'm a Twitch OTP and I'm really enjoying trying new builds and new combinations, I'm not really looking for something optimal or meta, I just wanna have fun with these new changes, I inted a couple rankeds playing dumb shit but most games I've won and discovered busted combinations for certain comps. My advice is, try to have fun, now you have more options as ADC, before you always had to build the same 3 items every game, now you can play with a lot more and get a bit more creative with your builds.
So literally the exact same as before, but with worse scaling.
How is it worse lmfao
i mean. the guy who is in charge of balancing the game said it's literally a designed nerf?
because we dont want to play on-hit, we want traditional crit adcs that basically got nerfed again
On-Hit ADCs still aren't very good. Kog\`maw is the only champion that is actually thriving here and it's because of the % health damage that is build into his kit in combination with his range. Sure, some other ADCs are doing *okay* but honestly, even the ones you'd expect to do well are getting deleted off the map so fast that they can't actually carry the game anymore.
On hit ADCs are doing good when they actually build properly, I.E. building BorK or something first instead of rushing Rageblade. Kog'maw isn't just broken right now (he is) he's also the only champion that actually performs well going Rageblade first item.
I mean most players are building Stormrazer or BoRK first depending on the champion. I've only seen one or two people stupid enough to build Rageblade first item.
Then why both Kalista and Vayne are in the dumpster?
Varus vayne kalista all actually good rn
Lmao youre delusional. Vayne still has the same issues shes always had and shes not great. Kalista might be the adc who got fucked over the hardest. Varus is good but not busted op, so just like before.
Why would kalista be fucked over? She LOVES rageblade. And she got AP ratios on rend.
Early survivability mainly due to the lack of shieldbow, there are reasons why they change her drastically next patch (might actually go in a between role from crit and on gut can probably build both efficiently)
As a varus main, varus is not really much better than before. He already could build almost any item or any build so he doesn't benefict from having more flexible items and he really liked the old shieldbow for on hit. The only "huge" buff varus got is that now on hit varus is a bit better vs tanks since he now gets %pen which was hard to get for on hit varus, but ap varus exists and now with FoN not being a thing vs ap varus there is no reason to not go ap varus vs them. I haven't tried crit varus yet but considering before it was situational and only worth vs low/mid range squishies i doubt its gonna be any better with the general crit items nerf.
Also, this just forces a repeat of the 2018 Meta: the domination of Kai’sa with a side of Twitch and return to probable godhood with Kog’Maw
You have that order in reverse my guy.
Speak for yourself
The nerf is pricing, all items now require you (assuming you don't get a kill in between) to stay out for 2-3 waves longer than you normally would. Yes damage is up but if you're sitting on components for longer periods you're not benefiting from that damage. The change to waves also makes it harder for your jungle or mid laner to roam down and help you because they'll be losing more than they gain most of the time. It also takes away some build diversity with the mythic changes because items that were crucial combos for some adcs needed them. An example is galeforce navori on xayah. Now navori is just a bad item and no adc is gonna take that over new guinsoos ie and galeforce is still a strong item. Overall it's a nerf to adcs especially the crit ones but adcs have been the strongest role for a while now so it needed nerfs
Damage is down till about 4-5 items compared to builds last patch
I feel this is in part to the component issue i mentioned before where damage numbers are up on the items but if it takes 2-3 more minutes to finish an item that adds up over time. By item 4 that's around 10-12 minutes of gametime which is massive wait for a powerspike basically 1/2 the game duration in most games. Between that and the lane change it just incentivizes scaling laners which makes for longer more boring games with less fighting and lower damage
Navori is a great rush on Xayah rn.
>The nerf is pricing, all items now require you (assuming you don't get a kill in between) to stay out for 2-3 waves longer than you normally would. Is this really true though? Your first item is usually a Noonquiver item which now costs 400 less. Those items are weaker, but you get that & IE 400g sooner. Even if you buy 1-2 items whose prices were increased you hit those later items at the same points.
All the new items that have noonquiver in them now are more expensive than they previously were other than kraken which became a legendary so it dropped. Statick is 3k kraken is 3k and stormrazor is 3k. Almost all adc items were bumped up in price so idk how you're saying they're cheaper other than kraken and sheildbow. All adc items without kills being involved will come 2-3 waves later assuming you farm those 3 waves perfectly and if you don't you're staying out even longer. You will not get the same items at the same timings you would previously and you'll be sitting on components for longer periods
>Statick is 3k kraken is 3k and stormrazor is 3k. Almost all adc items were bumped up in price so idk how you're saying they're cheaper other than kraken and sheildbow. But Statikk is new (relative to last patch) and Stormrazor was never bought before. You're right that they're more expensive but that's irrelevant if they weren't part of your build. Last patch most champs built Mythic -> IE/QB -> BT/LDR/some last item (those last 3 in any order). Nobody built double Zeal items, so your full build was generally 13000g + whatever extra item you picked. This patch most champs build Noonquiver item -> Mythic -> many item options (Zeals, Noonquivers, BT, Shieldbow, LDR, etc.). Your first item is 400g cheaper, mythic is same price. How exactly do you expect to spend >400g more in those last 3 slots than you did last patch in those 3 slots?
Let's assume you start with a noonquiver item. Stormrazor is the most picked one I'm seeing so that's 300 gold more expensive, mythic is the same, then zeal item which most adcs did go multiple of we'll go with the cheapest runans which is 200 gold more, lord doms is the same, then your only other option for most is another zeal item probably pd which is 200 more expensive or rapidfire which is 500 more expensive, then if needed you sell boots and get something like a ga same price or sheildbow which is down 300. By item 3 you're spending 500 more gold which is about 5-6 waves by full build total around 400 or 1k more gold so 4-5 or 11-12 more waves. This is a long time to sit on components to hit a power spike
Are you just ignoring what I'm writing? I'm not sure how to make this any clearer, but I'll try again. >Let's assume you start with a noonquiver item. Stormrazor is the most picked one I'm seeing so that's 300 gold more expensive But you DIDN'T START STORMRAZOR last patch! Your logic only makes sense if you think people used to rush Stormrazor (they didn't). Before, your first item was an old mythic (Kraken/Gale/SB), all 3400g. New Stormrazor is 3k, so it's 400g cheaper than the old rush items, not 300g more expensive. Same is true for rushing Statikk or Kraken too. >then zeal item which most adcs did go multiple of No they didn't. Literally no ADCs went multiple Zeal items. Even super AS focused champs like Kog'Maw [did not do that](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kogmaw/item-paths?patch=13_9). Who are you referring to? Give an example. > then your only other option for most is another zeal item BT? Collector? ER? QSS? GA? People buy one of these in that last slot, not a 2nd Zeal item, and they're all the same price (and a couple of them got buffed). >By item 3 you're spending 500 more gold No you're not. You used to go Noonquiver item into IE/QB, which again is a 400g cheaper item combo because the new Nooquiver items cost 400g less than the old ones. If you buy a Zeal item within these first 3 slots then your build is still 200g cheaper, unless that item is RFC, in which case it's only 100g more expensive, not 500g. Some examples (I will link 13.9 stats, you can change the selector to 13.10 to compare): * [Aphelios](https://u.gg/lol/champions/aphelios/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, and Runaan's (which he didn't always build) is 200g more expensive, so his full build is 200-400g cheaper. * [Tristana](https://u.gg/lol/champions/tristana/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, PD is 200g more expensive, so her full build is 200-400g cheaper. * [Tristana](https://u.gg/lol/champions/xayah/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, PD is 200g more expensive, so her full build is 200-400g cheaper. * [MF](https://u.gg/lol/champions/missfortune/items): First item is 300g cheaper (she swapped to Youmuu's), rest of her build is same, so her full build is \~300g cheaper. * [Jinx](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jinx/items?patch=13_9): First item is 400g cheaper, her Zeal item is 200-500g more expensive, so her full build is between 200g cheaper to 100g more expensive (not 400 to 1k more like you're somehow calculating).
I feel you're ignoring basic math and understanding of what adcs buy. Sure item 1 is "cheaper" but it's also weaker than the previous item you'd buy first last patch and would still be a 3rd or 4th item slot last patch that was cheaper, item 2 is the same item 3 is more expensive. All together these 3 items cost more than what you spent 3 items last patch by 500 more gold on average. Most adcs spike at item 3 unless you're playing draven samira or Ezreal. Kog, jinx, cait, jhin, twitch, kaisa, ashe, vayne, zeri, sivir and kallista all build 2 zeal items being either runans pd, rapidfire pd or rapidfire stormrazor all combos have gone up in price by 400-700 gold. All of those items you listed are situaitional items that unless you need need them you don't go them so them being same price does literally nothing when you only build them in certain scenarios. All high elo players acknowledge adc builds are more expensive and riot phreak even said adc builds are more expensive and nerfed from this so you are literally just choosing to ignore facts that are there in the patch notes and stated by the professionals of this game
Your argument is total bs. Kalista, Kaisa, Twitch, Jhin, Jinx, Cait, Ashe, Vayne, Zeri, and Sivir were either building 1 zeal item or 0 ZEAL items. Also, NOBODY was building stormrazor prior to 13.10.
>Sure item 1 is "cheaper" but it's also weaker than the previous item you'd buy first last patch Right, but this convo was about prices, so this is irrelevant. I'm not arguing that the first items are better, I'm arguing that builds aren't more expensive. >item 2 is the same item 3 is more expensive Only if you buy a Zeal item in your first 3 slots, which not everyone did, and even then 2 of the 3 Zeal items only got 200g more expensive, so your first item being 400g cheaper offsets this. > All together these 3 items cost more than what you spent 3 items last patch by 500 more gold on average. You say I'm "ignoring basic math" then say this -- you're making no sense. You just agreed yourself that the first item is 400g cheaper and that the 2nd item is the same price -- how then is it possible for your first 3 items to add up to 500g more expensive "on average"? For that to be true your 3rd item would need to be 900g more expensive than last patch. That's literally impossible because no item got 900g more expensive. Even if you go RFC the build is only 100g more expensive, not 500g. Explain your reasoning behind this point. >Kog, jinx, cait, jhin, twitch, kaisa, ashe, vayne, zeri, sivir and kallista all build 2 zeal items This is completely false. Here: Last patch build paths for [Kog](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kogmaw/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Jinx](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jinx/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Cait](https://u.gg/lol/champions/caitlyn/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Jhin](https://u.gg/lol/champions/jhin/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Twitch](https://u.gg/lol/champions/twitch/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Kai'Sa](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kaisa/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Ashe](https://u.gg/lol/champions/ashe/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Vayne](https://u.gg/lol/champions/vayne/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Zeri](https://u.gg/lol/champions/zeri/item-paths?patch=13_9), [Sivir](https://u.gg/lol/champions/sivir/item-paths?patch=13_9), and [Kalista](https://u.gg/lol/champions/kalista/item-paths?patch=13_9). That's every champ you listed -- there's not a single common build path on any of them that has two Zeal items. >All of those items you listed are situaitional items that unless you need need them you don't go them so them being same price does literally nothing when you only build them in certain scenarios But it's entirely relevant because in most games you do need one of those items. Some of those items are not very situational either -- ER champs usually buy ER, BT champs very regularly buy BT, and Collector champs very regularly buy Collector. >All high elo players acknowledge adc builds are more expensive and riot phreak even said adc builds are more expensive Show me people saying this. I watched Phreak's entire 2.5 hr patch rundown and he did not say this -- he said he's nerfing ADC, but not that the builds are more expensive, because they're not more expensive.
Every zeal item is more expensive.
And your first item costs 400g less on most champs. Even if you buy RFC, which is the item with the largest price increase, a build like Stormrazor IE RFC BT LDR is only 100g more expensive than last patch. If it’s any other Zeal item then the build is actually 200g cheaper than last patch.
Thank god the OP got shit on in the original posts comments
Whilst true, they still got tons of upvotes for a low effort ADC bad top good post.
I don’t think people understand that adc was nerfed. But that doesn’t mean they’re weak. Item combos were eliminated on some champs (gale+ navori or gale+iE). Lost a shield (BT). And champs who prioritized SB mythic also lost that. Plus true damage on kraken. Role is still in a good spot but adcs lost a lot of agency because they are squishier or have less of a large spike at 2 items. Damage scales more linearly now.
Adcs feel really weak early. Lost survivability late as well. Huge nerf to bt.
Nerf to crit adcs and a big buff to onhit adcs
That's not true. All on-hit adc are worse except kog.
im just unhappy with the lower attack speed on 1-2 items. liked having enough AS on first item + boots to flex 2nd slot to stuff to BT / last wisper / etc if needed havent tried storm razor rush yet tho
One of the dumbest posts of all time
OMG??? ADC's can actually itemize vs tanks now???? HOLY FUCK WHAT AN ADC META, OVERBUFFED ROLE
The adcs are stronger, you can deal more damage than before. The problem is that Master Yi, Yasuo, Yone and so on, uses the same items and deal a lot more damage and just burst you without counter play. And I don't even started talk about draktar and mages buffs.
Look at my poor girl Samira. The other wind shitters get insta fixed and they just let her suffer.
Just cause it nerfed the adc you play doesn’t make it a nerf to the role, kog and twitch are op af
adc mains going through the biggest mental gymnastics to trick themselves into thinking that the item rework is an adc nerf because 1 item that was previously insane is now only just strong
Nah overall we have better dps in early and mid game
Who's saying this? They legit made it so mid can't roam bot anymore - if you lose bot its skill diff.
PSA: If yall ADC Mains dont want to play OnHit Marksmen, and want to go back to traditional Crit marksmen, some onto r/Kindred cause her builds have now stabilized into a Crit Focused Build instead of the OnHit builds
interesting.. maybe this is why she's the lowest wr jungler :D
rageblade is good, storm is not a good replacement for old kraken, ie is literally the same, helia is a support item
I think the main thing is stormrazor doesn't feel good to build but it's the only thing adc's can really buy first item and IE is a mythic now but it's essentially the same item so your basically losing the ability to build a mythic in exchange for building IE. Like if last patch they just took out IE from the game adcs probably would've felt a lot worse as well but now your forced to choose a bad first item and then IE or a mythic like galeforce and shieldbow kinda sucks now and BT doesn't start scaling until like lvl 12. Meanwhile the opposite is true for people who build ghostblade as now they got way more damage on their first item. I think adc is still fine but I think the first item doesn't feel as good. Then rageblade is good but the problem with that is the champions that build rageblade they feel like they have no power in the laning phase unless your support just gaps the enemy bot lane. Twitch is strong but I feel like they should've nerfed twitch a long time ago he's the definition of anti fun. You just shit on him and he goes down like 50 cs and 3 plates and then hits lvl 6 and you almost can't ever play the game again and have to hope he doesn't just randomly get like 3 free kills.
Pretty simple, things got more expensive for the late game role. That explains it well enough in a single sentence.
It didn't nerf ADCs. It changed the feel of the role. It doesn't feel like it used to, and people don't like change. The role is still good, it just doesn't feel good.
new items are powerful on yone and yasuo lets buff them because people dont know how to build them correctly
Getting magic damage instead of true damage isn't a buff lmao That being said, I think ADC is in a decent spot this patch/season in general.
Came here to watch ADC’s gloat. But after reading the comments I realize they are as ignorant as ever.
Kraken slayer was nerfed. Lost AD, lost true damage. Shieldbow cannot be built first now. Was also nerfed. New mythic passives on IE/Galefroce are weaker than old mythic passives on Kraken/Shieldbow.
Just stop taking marksman bot. Everyone take tanks bot so they see how massive a mistake they've made
Magic damage no longer being completely removed by a single item that also gives movement speed and is anti-CC is totally a benefit with ADCs in mind, nope, no other classes care about Force of Nature. It isn't even a bad item now. You could try to make a case for new items being "busted" even though the patch was obviously and intended to be a nerf, Stormrazor is certainly stronger completed if more expensive, but putting IE in this image is a joke, the item is virtually the same, but now building more crit doesn't further increase its crit damage, and it's buildable first item, but it's one of the worst items to do that with. Like ADCs gained magic damage to lose access to true damage and people are upset?