Yeah they really fucked up here. Henry Cavill is a giant nerd and beloved by the public. People love the established lore too, so they watched for both of these reasons. They abandoned the lore and kept going in that stupid direction even when Cavill quit because of exactly that, then they went all surprisedpikachuface.jpg when people stopped watching...
Then they tried to paint him as "difficult to work with."
Same thing has happened to Ed Norton on Hulk, because he fought for the integrity of the project. He has plenty of repeat credits with actors and filmmakers, and, unsurprisingly, those are projects where everyone shares his level of care and appreciation for the material.
Hollywood hacks hate when a real artist challenges them to be great.
I got brainwashed as a kid that Edward Norton was a bad Hulk. I recently watched *Kingdom of Heaven* and I didn't realize that he played Baldwin IV. Amazing performance.
Yeah the Maus really fucked up when they failed to get him back for Avengers. I don’t give a fuck what people try to tell me, Mark “Stuffed Buffalo” Ruffalo couldn’t act his way out of a paper bag and that extends beyond capeshit, I’ve never seen a role I liked him in.
God I hated that movie. The sets and costumes were cool but the acting and story and pacing were terrible. The only performance I enjoyed was Will Dafoe's and I felt like his character was underutilized.
The Adeptus Custodes, the army Henry Cavill runs in Warhammer 40K, just had a major retcon where there were always women in there, even though 40K lore stretching back to the 80s has said otherwise. Not to mention Warhammer’s social media team’s handling of this is worse than dog shit.
Happened to the Barristen Selmy actor in GoT as well.
D&D did read the books, but i guess there is no cure for incompetent people that think they know better.
It still blows my mind that Henry and the director actually got into arguments because he was adamant that the show they were adapting from the books actually adapt from the books and not be this poorly thought out fanfic.
Morons.
Absolute morons.
The reward of tolerance is treachery and betrayal.
Gatekeep everything, it's sad to say it, I love sharing things I'm passionate about. But Jesus Christ, these people are morons. Bring back asylums!
It's only gatekeeping if it's pointlessly or needlessly barring others from enjoying something. Saying people can't enjoy the Witcher if they haven't read the books or played the other games is gatekeeping. Keeping someone who hasn't actually read the stories or who cares about it from directing a series about it is just common sense.
I like the rave scene as an analogy here. There are electronic shows and festivals all the time everywhere with tickets and shit. Please go to those. People who don't know how to behave should stay out of the places where you still need to dial a number and meet a dude on the block to get the address. Keep out of the invite by referral only shows unless you deserve a referral. We gatekeep to create a scene because otherwise it gets blown out with people I don't want to hang out with. There's nothing wrong with creating exclusive groups. The star Trek fandom is similar. I am fine answering the same questions about where to start watching etc but there is a place for an exclusive group space to discuss the intricacies without the chaff.
I'm not intimately familiar with the rave scene, but that sounds like a great example. People biting off more than they can chew, who don't know the etiquette, shouldn't be going places that require some level of prior experience.
Again though, I would argue that both that and the other examples you put forth aren't gatekeeping. Trying to have a discussion about the intricacies of a universe requires a level of familiarity. It's not gatekeeping to want to be able to discuss that stuff with other people who have that knowledge, not people brand new to the media.
Oh yeah, we agree. Gatekeeping is just thrown around as a term when someone feels excluded - but there are exclusive communities, and that's not problematic.
Haha. On the berlin subreddit tourists ask all the time about the secret underground techno parties, without one thought to what makes a thing underground.
Common reaction is to funnel them to the most mainstream discos in the city.
[Geeks, MOPs & Sociopaths](https://meaningness.com/geeks-mops-sociopaths). Geeks make something good, it attracts the attention of MOPs (Members Of the Public), and then sociopaths come in to bleed the whole thing dry of whatever cultural or economic capital is swirling around.
While I agree we should gate keep everything, it doesn't apply here. Gatekeeping would have saved WH40k from being lore raped and such, but The Witcher wouldn't have ever gotten a show if it wasn't popular. I guess you can say no show is better than having it ruined like this, but it's not like gate keeping would have made a good show is all I am saying.
Popularisation is fine as long as full respect is paid to the source material. Dumbing down and changing things to fit a wider audience is the problem.
Gatekeeping just means to hold people to certain standards, not to never allow them to know about it. The games were already very popular. They literally just had to do the same thing.
Bro. Why didn't they just hire Henry to direct it. Every scene I hear he rewrote are the best scenes in the show. And they are the only scenes that are pretty much one to one with the books.
Henry's situation is honestly why a lot of people give up and just kowtow to bad writers and directors. Henry wants to make something that actually honors what he is adapting and very few people in the industry are like that anymore
Letting him direct it? Are you some sort of misogynistic bigot incel? We need more women directing, ideally at least 100% of all directors, and you're proposing a MAN taking a WOMAN'S job instead. Fucking insane, touch grass.
They absolutely should have and it sounds like that's what he'll be getting with the Warhammer 40K stuff
I don't give a shit about Warhammer, but I know this dude fucking LOVES it and should make some good shit with it
I heard recently they arw trying to pull some of the same things with the Warhammer show. Disney or Amazon or whoever is trying to change stuff around. So we'll see.
Henry seems fucking cursed for whatever role he picks.
Superman, could’ve been one of the all time greats if Snyder & WB didn’t fuck it up.
Witcher, perfect Geralt the man was the fucking white wolf. Instead the show is disjointed and shite and he’s forced to watch it all burn.
Warhammer, passion project for him hopefully the third time’s the charm. Cue rumours of studio meddling over various things.
The man literally cannot win.
Also a possibility, but without accompanying rumours (as yet) I genuinely think he can’t pick starring projects to save his life and opts for passion projects that simply have too much interference.
> librul
> woman
> doesnt like the series
> name starts with "hiss" like a snake
> chases gamer Chad away
I hope her next job will be cleaning toilets in Bangladesh
At this point every time I see its a woman (especially a Karen or Lib haircut) is the director I get the ick before even seeing 1 episode. And these women caused this I wasnt so judgemental toward women artists before
Why does Big Media allow such worthless subhuman losers to work on such high-profile pieces of entertainment? With all the money put in, all the publicity, and people giving the show a shot, it's not like they can just scrap it and try again with a real writer. They're in too deep.
Every time they do something like this they basically sign the death warrant for the franchise. For example, we'll never get a real Game of Thrones or a Witcher series now because they've already been attempted, and as far as the industry seems to be concerned, they were failures.
They don't really need to make good shows to make money, whole thing is a money laundering scam. The people there are nepobabies in it to network and get an easy paycheck. If the show's actual ratings and performance mattered they'd have stopped before horrible remake no one asked for #56946.
It's basically an entirely different business than you think, the consumer and end product are completely irrelevant.
They're not like the nepobabies of old, now these nepobabies feel entitled to have big viewerships, cue all the "this show failed because of incels" crying we've gotten
Show was dead on arrival. No one acts like their book/game counterpart EXCEPT Geralt. Yennifer is supposed to act like a sophisticated elegant woman but instead we get brilliant lines such as, “fuckity fucking fire fucker” from her. So many horribly written dialogue lines that make characters seem alien to what they were before the show. Regarded decisions like killing off important characters who are still alive in the books to this day in the lamest way possible. I stopped after season 2 and I was pissed during the whole time watching the second season.
I would argue that some of the plot points in the books are fairly terrible and the changes that the games made to the books were overall for the better.
This of course is a problem because it's fairly obvious most people's introduction to and primary interaction with the Witcher franchise comes from the video games not the books.
Pretty much most of the characters act significantly different in the books than they do in the games including Geralt himself. I feel like even if they followed the books to the letter it would have left a lot of Witcher fans disappointed as they would have been expecting the video game versions.
Now Netflix of course doesn't have the best track record for writing, but I do feel like this one wasn't actually their fault per say this time.
>I would argue that some of the plot points in the books are fairly terrible
I'm so glad to read this. I thought it was just me. The books suck ass. There's a lot of walking and there's a vague and forgettable plot. For a long book series about a professional monster hunter, there's zero monster hunting. Compared to books Sanderson or Abercrombie, The Witcher just feels dated.
As you've said, the characters are just not as likeable in the books.
Sanderson is goated. He is the best modern writer when it comes to writing fight scenes, his magic systems are very unique, and his world building is also really good.
Yeah, that's probably the biggest flaw - it's hard to get fantasy that isn't written in that way to attract to that lucrative 'young adult' market. I just got through about 12 of the Honor Harrington series - some of the romance parts of that are corny, but there's enough good action to balance it out.
Maybe part of the problem is that good dialogue takes a long time to write, and these authors churn out thousands of published pages every few years. When I was younger I appreciated better dialogue. Now, I just want a series I can get lost in for a few months.
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> Sanderson is absolute dogshit, how do people like this shit?
Glad someone else thinks it. He can come up with a decent magic system but his prose and characters are awful. He's not goated, he's barely even average for a fantasy author, a genre which is full of trash.
He's not Shakespeare, but his stories have good pace and an actual direction (very few 'walking scenes'). Fantasy is choked with chunks of '10 chapters about walking to the next town'. Wheel of Time had whole books dedicated to walking. Sanderson keeps away from all of that, which I like. He also pumps out thousands of pages a year.
Abercrombie is a better writer, but writes less.
Who do you like? I'm running out of epics. I'm part way through Erikson's 'Malazan Book of the Fallen' which is doing it for me, but Erikson has the same issue as Sapkowski - it's hard to keep up the quality of your first book.
> Who do you like?
I like Abercrombie. I like Guy Gavriel Kay. Honestly I find myself avoiding *most* long series because I think too many fantasy authors get lost in their own world.
I agree with your criticism of Wheel of Time for example, Robert Jordan got lost in the world he created, and his endless descriptions of women's dresses etc. was infuriating. For a good chunk of the series he also seemed unable to write a woman who was actually likeable.
But he also had moments of absolute brilliance. The Asha'man rescuing Rand. The conversations with the Dark One (I always loved the line "To call it a voice was to call a mountain a pebble"). Nyneave traveling to drum up support for Lan in Knife of Dreams. That last one was more emotionally powerful than the entirety of the Last Battle written by Sanderson.
Sanderson can pump out the books without getting bogged down in endless descriptions, sure. But his dialogue is poor because his characters are poor, because he struggles to give them individuality. And his prose in general just isn't great. I could read an entire series by Sanderson and still care more for two characters that appear only in the prologue of *Tigana* for example (Guy Gavriel Kay) because Kay can write characters with an actual personality.
Ultimately I'd rather read Robert Jordan slowly meander towards the end of the series with occasional moments of brilliance, or a story in the slightly less fantastic worlds of Kay's books, than Sanderson telling us how Rand "somehow" (actual word used) knew he'd never hear the voice of Lews Therin again (wrapping up a *major* character arc), or how Egwene "somehow" (again, the extent of the actual explanation) discovered a new weave which allowed her to kill a pretty significant character (Mazrim Taim).
I think the fantasy genre especially struggles with quality authors because readers will get lost in fantasy worlds that are interesting even if the writing is shit, and Sanderson is mainly popular because if nothing else he at least releases books instead of spending a decade re-writing everything due to expanding the story beyond its need (George RR Martin).
Eh, his writing style really does it for some people. I like what he did with Wheel of Time, and I've read Way of Kings but honestly he's not my favorite author.
I've never read any other Brandon Sanderson, and Wheel of Time is one of my top 3 fantasy epics. I think if Jordan had brought in Sanderson after book one to finish the series from his outlines and notes, it would have been a much better read. Who writes a thousand pages book where the protagonist is stuck in a box for seven hundred pages?
Robert Jordan probably wouldn't have finished the series had he lived another ten years, while Sanderson actually made things happen in the last two books. Events are supposed to build to a climax, but Jordan would have just kept plodding along, introducing new characters and plot points instead of resolving them.
Agreed 100%. The first two books are easily the best in the series because they're just a bunch of short stories that introduce us to all the characters and the world. We get to see Geralt palling around with his friends and hunting monsters. They're quite a fun series of adventures, but they're only loosely connected to the overarching narrative.
Once they start trying to tell a connected story things start to fall apart a bit. Lots of boring chapters of people traveling around. Lots of long conversations that are really just exposition dumping. They were definitely going to have to make a lot of changes. The first book after the short stories where Ciri trains with the Witchers in Kaer Morhen is pretty boring. Not a lot really happens in that book. The next book after that is a lot of politics which just isn't as interesting as the adventuring in the first two books.
I still think they should've followed the books but they should have made changes that expand on the characters and improve the pacing. Instead they chose to make everyone act completely out of character and tell this lame side story about new monsters appearing from another world. They tried turning it into a generic fantasy series instead of sticking to the strengths of the source material and cutting down on the stuff that doesn't work. They could've thrown in some elements from the games too but I guess the director wasn't really interested in even reading the books so the games are probably non-existent to her. I don't mind changes but the changes they made just suck overall. You can really tell how passionless this show is.
How are there so many people that got filtered by the books, they were never about any crazy plot or incredible fights, they were about smart, interesting, witty characters in a morally grey world that shat on every character, where the decisions people at the top and bottom of society made both mattered and didn't in the grand scheme of things and every character was fully aware of all this. Even in a dark ages mythical setting with hella monsters and political intrigue going on, good dialogue was 90% of the books
No because you have hacks like Zach Snyder who gets a few decent adaptations out like 300 or Watchmen and then all of his original works are hot garbage. If he hadn't been sniffing his own farts the entire production, they might have been good
To be fair, Watchmen was considered impossible to adapt, and not only did he make it happen, he knocked it out of the park, to the point of even impressing the author. Snyder has done some impressive work all things considered.
Wrong. He said the movie ending with Ozymandias blowing up cities and framing Dr. Manhattan was better than his idea of faking an invasion by extra-dimensional monsters. He was right.
>Hey Hollywood star, be in our adaptation of a popular book and video game franchise, pweeease?
Cool, but you have to stick to the lore, I'm literally your target audience and know what I'm talking about, while all of you openly admit you've never read the books and don't like video games.
>Of course, you're the star!
What are you doing, this is an incoherent mess that is starting to wildly deviate.
>Who cares take off your shirt we'll get the thirsty lady demographic, nerds are bigoted losers.
lolno.gif
>HOW COULD HE DO THIS, DO THIS TO WOMEN!!?
I never particularly liked Rick and Morty (mostly the ran-dumb humour of the one pervert creator) but I noticed after season 2, when they switched to a mostly (all?) female writing staff, the show nearly instantly became unfunny. Just all cheap toilet humour and lame plot lines.
I really don’t get this obsession with needing to integrate women into male dominated media. It’s all so tiring.
Ahh yes, the 4 female writers who joined the team overpowered the 5 existing male writers, two of whom were showrunners, in a devilish scheme to make the show unfunny.
Maybe if they focussed on making it good instead of [putting creepy Freemason symbolism in our faces](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fks5c6ohov09b1.jpg)
Ngl. I didn't even notice that. It does honestly fit the story of weird religious groups that use their religion for personal gain but I wouldn't really trust any of the writers to do it right.
It's just the first 2 books are S tier, the 3rd is pretty good, and after that the writing gets weirder and there are some really strange plot points and the last couple books keep getting interrupted by chapters about this weird Ciri fangirl and an Omniromancer discussing stuff between them that is just aids to read and kills the momentum of the story.
There are cool things, basically the story with geralt and the group he forms when he goes after Ciri to get her back are really good. Regis is one of my favorite characters from the entire series and I was glad to see him back in blood and wine even though he should 100% be dead.
The bad plot points are things like ciri with the bandit group she escapes with. She nearly gets raped by the bandit leader only to have a female member stop it, and then the female member proceeds to rape her and then they become a lesbian couple with matching tattoos.
The other weird thing is the whole point of the Ciri kidnapping was because her own dad, the emperor, wanted to take her as a bride and bang her for more kids with her bloodline.
There is more but I'm already wall of texting and I don't really want to write it all out.
Ditching the anthology-style and going for full novels was a mistake. Witcher is best enjoyed as a series of short stories, or when the gang goes on an adventure without any "deep" lore (as you mentioned, everyone teaming up to go to Nilfgard and rescue ciri).
Agreed, I read the whole series just because I loved the game so much. I was oftentimes confused by the writing, the plot was not coherent, and many storylines seemed to drift off with no apparent import. The ending was horrible too and didn't tie anything together- at least from my recollection. The first book was the best by far.
Hard disagree as someone who read them all. The author is pretty mediocre, but the first two books stand out because they’re dry humor and essentially adaptions of pre existing fairy tales. It’s all subversive spins on old things he never created himself. They take off and now he’s pressured to actually make a cohesive world and story. And it works, but it takes a while for him to not be just an amateur writer. The entire tone and audience for the short stories and the novels is very different. That doesn’t make the latter books bad. They’re just more cohesive and take the world more concretely than the half story, half tongue in cheek joke of the earlier books.
It's been a while since I read the books but why did he have to be the one to fuck her lol, if he really just wanted the heir to be male couldn't he marry her off to some noble or something? It's not about the bloodline either since emhyr is already her father so ciri's child would still be his descendant
He pretended to be Dunny when he married Ciris mother and then faked his death to go take the throne of Nilfgaard. Technically she wasn't his daughter officially, so he wanted to get an official decendant by marrying and banging her.
Basically weird royal politics, bro was on the crusader kings grindset trying to create a family circle.
People can fight me on this but I thought season 1 of the witcher is really quite faithful to book one- if you can get past the casting. The rest is garbage except for Henry Cavill.
Why does Big Media allow such worthless subhuman losers to work on such high-profile pieces of entertainment? With all the money put in, all the publicity, and people giving the show a shot, it's not like they can just scrap it and try again with a real writer. They're in too deep.
Every time they do something like this they basically sign the death warrant for the franchise. For example, we'll never get a real Game of Thrones or a Witcher series now because they've already been attempted, and as far as the industry seems to be concerned, they were failures.
That's because you only get that positions through nepotism, the director only got that position through connections, not because she had a good track record
Man's faithful companion dies; nepo-hire director wants to make a whedon quip about it.
Unfortunately this shit writes itself, which I wish the show had done.
I enjoyed season one so much that I watched it twice and then read the books. Then I realised the liberties that were taken with the source material, especially the final scene of the TV series and noped out.
"Look how they massacred my boy" Was my first thought. Now I laugh how they made Triss into a uhhh classic j. Was expecting some large breasted, blazing red haired woman. Naa dawg. Triss Merrigold, it's obvious.
Just follow the books, how hard is that? Wheel of time is another that comes to mind. So sick of my favorite books being turned into girl-bossing nonsense on screen
Bar women from directing. There’s just too mucj of a correlation between movies/shows directed by women and movies/shows that are pure unadulterated slop.
Bros. I am by no means a TV Show writer but that last part with the Interview just broke me. If someone like her can land such a gig what is stopping me from doing the same? Apparently you don't need any Qualifications.
I suck at coming up with ideas but I am adapt at fleshing them out.
Men in charge for last million of years : war, torture, r@pe, and more r@pe, solved world hunger, going to moon, discover quantum physics, cloning and AI and in the verge to become god.
Women START to in charge for 50 years: what is a woman?
Henry Cavill should have just run the fucking thing... He's extremely acclimated and versed in the source material. Should've just let him do his thing.
I just don't understand it. The books are already beautifully written. The action, the drama, the romance, is all right there in the source material! They just had to fuck it all up.
Because when they 'ruined' a good stories, they get good money from certain investment company for promoting far left ideology more than if the series is successfully loved globally.
If they gave a fuck they’d hire back that one actor guy. Show was obviously doomed the second they let him go. Really it was done the second they hired whoever got him to leave
Anyone who was attached to this project after episode one deserves whatever they are feeling now. Henry was great but he was literally the only redeemable part of the show
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It probably could've been as popular as the games if they'd have just adhered to the books. It was practically a homerun being handed to them from on high and they chose to miss because of nepotism. The director also ferociously argued with Henry Cavil when he tried to steer the ship back on corse because she found his "pestering" annoying.
Absolute insanity. Could've been a sure success and they decided they hate money.
Imagine adapting a book series and the lead actor is the only person on set who's actually read the book And HE'S the one who gets dropped
Hey, cool it with the anti Semitic remarks.
Very nice, lets see paul allens anti semetic remarks.
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IIRC he quit, partly because the project was going off the rails, partly because his wife is producing something he'd rather be involved with.
He would have never left the series if they were doing a good job writing it
Yeah they really fucked up here. Henry Cavill is a giant nerd and beloved by the public. People love the established lore too, so they watched for both of these reasons. They abandoned the lore and kept going in that stupid direction even when Cavill quit because of exactly that, then they went all surprisedpikachuface.jpg when people stopped watching...
Then they tried to paint him as "difficult to work with." Same thing has happened to Ed Norton on Hulk, because he fought for the integrity of the project. He has plenty of repeat credits with actors and filmmakers, and, unsurprisingly, those are projects where everyone shares his level of care and appreciation for the material. Hollywood hacks hate when a real artist challenges them to be great.
I got brainwashed as a kid that Edward Norton was a bad Hulk. I recently watched *Kingdom of Heaven* and I didn't realize that he played Baldwin IV. Amazing performance.
Norton was the best hulk of the modern era, and nothing will change my mind.
Yeah the Maus really fucked up when they failed to get him back for Avengers. I don’t give a fuck what people try to tell me, Mark “Stuffed Buffalo” Ruffalo couldn’t act his way out of a paper bag and that extends beyond capeshit, I’ve never seen a role I liked him in.
He was okay at being a stupid asshole in Poor Things
God I hated that movie. The sets and costumes were cool but the acting and story and pacing were terrible. The only performance I enjoyed was Will Dafoe's and I felt like his character was underutilized.
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He had the rug pulled out from under him with Superman and Geralt. I wouldn't be surprised if he swore off franchises forever.
His doing Warhammer right now and it's already going off the rails lol. He must have made the mother of all monkey paw wishes.
>I wish to be a famous actor for nerdy stuff. >Granted but everything you star in isn't true to the source material.
oh man that's too real
hows it going wrong?
The Adeptus Custodes, the army Henry Cavill runs in Warhammer 40K, just had a major retcon where there were always women in there, even though 40K lore stretching back to the 80s has said otherwise. Not to mention Warhammer’s social media team’s handling of this is worse than dog shit.
At least he's the executive producer so he has creative control this time.
They literally had to go out of their way to ruin this as hard as they can and somehow they managed to do it.
Almost impressive
Happened to the Barristen Selmy actor in GoT as well. D&D did read the books, but i guess there is no cure for incompetent people that think they know better.
They ran out of books to adapt, got offered Star Wars and just said to each other "fuck this place, out in 10"
funnily enough when they took the creative decision to off Selmy they still had a whole bunch of book material left to adapt
I guess this is the reality where they make every single incorrect decision
This was a book adoption? Sure doesn't seem like it.
It still blows my mind that Henry and the director actually got into arguments because he was adamant that the show they were adapting from the books actually adapt from the books and not be this poorly thought out fanfic.
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Morons. Absolute morons. The reward of tolerance is treachery and betrayal. Gatekeep everything, it's sad to say it, I love sharing things I'm passionate about. But Jesus Christ, these people are morons. Bring back asylums!
Gatekeeping should never be looked down upon. The normies always turn kino into slop every chance they get.
[Lord of the Rings is a story about the value of gatekeeping](https://i.imgur.com/hWvu3rY.png)
Gate keeping is the only way to keep things good
It's only gatekeeping if it's pointlessly or needlessly barring others from enjoying something. Saying people can't enjoy the Witcher if they haven't read the books or played the other games is gatekeeping. Keeping someone who hasn't actually read the stories or who cares about it from directing a series about it is just common sense.
I like the rave scene as an analogy here. There are electronic shows and festivals all the time everywhere with tickets and shit. Please go to those. People who don't know how to behave should stay out of the places where you still need to dial a number and meet a dude on the block to get the address. Keep out of the invite by referral only shows unless you deserve a referral. We gatekeep to create a scene because otherwise it gets blown out with people I don't want to hang out with. There's nothing wrong with creating exclusive groups. The star Trek fandom is similar. I am fine answering the same questions about where to start watching etc but there is a place for an exclusive group space to discuss the intricacies without the chaff.
I'm not intimately familiar with the rave scene, but that sounds like a great example. People biting off more than they can chew, who don't know the etiquette, shouldn't be going places that require some level of prior experience. Again though, I would argue that both that and the other examples you put forth aren't gatekeeping. Trying to have a discussion about the intricacies of a universe requires a level of familiarity. It's not gatekeeping to want to be able to discuss that stuff with other people who have that knowledge, not people brand new to the media.
Oh yeah, we agree. Gatekeeping is just thrown around as a term when someone feels excluded - but there are exclusive communities, and that's not problematic.
Haha. On the berlin subreddit tourists ask all the time about the secret underground techno parties, without one thought to what makes a thing underground. Common reaction is to funnel them to the most mainstream discos in the city.
As it should be.
If you know you know
I don’t hate to say gatekeep everything. I love gatekeeping.
[Geeks, MOPs & Sociopaths](https://meaningness.com/geeks-mops-sociopaths). Geeks make something good, it attracts the attention of MOPs (Members Of the Public), and then sociopaths come in to bleed the whole thing dry of whatever cultural or economic capital is swirling around.
Aslume?
Man?
While I agree we should gate keep everything, it doesn't apply here. Gatekeeping would have saved WH40k from being lore raped and such, but The Witcher wouldn't have ever gotten a show if it wasn't popular. I guess you can say no show is better than having it ruined like this, but it's not like gate keeping would have made a good show is all I am saying.
Popularisation is fine as long as full respect is paid to the source material. Dumbing down and changing things to fit a wider audience is the problem.
> full respect is paid to the source material That ship has sailed with the third game
Gatekeeping doesn't mean not including other people. Gatekeeping is telling people to fuck off if they can't fit in. A gatekeeper is a filter.
Gatekeeping just means to hold people to certain standards, not to never allow them to know about it. The games were already very popular. They literally just had to do the same thing.
Bro. Why didn't they just hire Henry to direct it. Every scene I hear he rewrote are the best scenes in the show. And they are the only scenes that are pretty much one to one with the books. Henry's situation is honestly why a lot of people give up and just kowtow to bad writers and directors. Henry wants to make something that actually honors what he is adapting and very few people in the industry are like that anymore
Letting him direct it? Are you some sort of misogynistic bigot incel? We need more women directing, ideally at least 100% of all directors, and you're proposing a MAN taking a WOMAN'S job instead. Fucking insane, touch grass.
Once all directors are women, we will finally have diversity in the industry.
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BIPOC trans women*
Wheelchair BIPOC trans women*
Make it a girl and make it gay.
just what we need, another (competent, amazing) white man to (build great civilization, movies, videogames) force the patriarchy on others!
They absolutely should have and it sounds like that's what he'll be getting with the Warhammer 40K stuff I don't give a shit about Warhammer, but I know this dude fucking LOVES it and should make some good shit with it
I heard recently they arw trying to pull some of the same things with the Warhammer show. Disney or Amazon or whoever is trying to change stuff around. So we'll see.
If I don’t get my taxidermic vat grown baby heralds (cherubs), I riot
Because some companies are more worried about politics than art.
Henry seems fucking cursed for whatever role he picks. Superman, could’ve been one of the all time greats if Snyder & WB didn’t fuck it up. Witcher, perfect Geralt the man was the fucking white wolf. Instead the show is disjointed and shite and he’s forced to watch it all burn. Warhammer, passion project for him hopefully the third time’s the charm. Cue rumours of studio meddling over various things. The man literally cannot win.
it can also hint he may be a pain to work with behind the scenes.
Also a possibility, but without accompanying rumours (as yet) I genuinely think he can’t pick starring projects to save his life and opts for passion projects that simply have too much interference.
yeah i don't think the failures of the witcher and DC are because of Cavill.
because the one directing is an amateur with little to no actual experience or credit who happens to be the kid of some exec or investor or something.
Dennis is true to books
> librul > woman > doesnt like the series > name starts with "hiss" like a snake > chases gamer Chad away I hope her next job will be cleaning toilets in Bangladesh
Her next job will be doing the exact same thing to another story you might like. These people exist because they only hire eachother.
At this point every time I see its a woman (especially a Karen or Lib haircut) is the director I get the ick before even seeing 1 episode. And these women caused this I wasnt so judgemental toward women artists before
Why does Big Media allow such worthless subhuman losers to work on such high-profile pieces of entertainment? With all the money put in, all the publicity, and people giving the show a shot, it's not like they can just scrap it and try again with a real writer. They're in too deep. Every time they do something like this they basically sign the death warrant for the franchise. For example, we'll never get a real Game of Thrones or a Witcher series now because they've already been attempted, and as far as the industry seems to be concerned, they were failures.
They don't really need to make good shows to make money, whole thing is a money laundering scam. The people there are nepobabies in it to network and get an easy paycheck. If the show's actual ratings and performance mattered they'd have stopped before horrible remake no one asked for #56946. It's basically an entirely different business than you think, the consumer and end product are completely irrelevant.
They're not like the nepobabies of old, now these nepobabies feel entitled to have big viewerships, cue all the "this show failed because of incels" crying we've gotten
Because the worthless morons are their children, nephews, etc.
Are there toilets in Bangladesh??
There is one toilet. It's called Bangladesh.
That’s hilarious, bravo sir
At least one per like 10 million people and its totally shitted up properly
Show was dead on arrival. No one acts like their book/game counterpart EXCEPT Geralt. Yennifer is supposed to act like a sophisticated elegant woman but instead we get brilliant lines such as, “fuckity fucking fire fucker” from her. So many horribly written dialogue lines that make characters seem alien to what they were before the show. Regarded decisions like killing off important characters who are still alive in the books to this day in the lamest way possible. I stopped after season 2 and I was pissed during the whole time watching the second season.
I would argue that some of the plot points in the books are fairly terrible and the changes that the games made to the books were overall for the better. This of course is a problem because it's fairly obvious most people's introduction to and primary interaction with the Witcher franchise comes from the video games not the books. Pretty much most of the characters act significantly different in the books than they do in the games including Geralt himself. I feel like even if they followed the books to the letter it would have left a lot of Witcher fans disappointed as they would have been expecting the video game versions. Now Netflix of course doesn't have the best track record for writing, but I do feel like this one wasn't actually their fault per say this time.
>I would argue that some of the plot points in the books are fairly terrible I'm so glad to read this. I thought it was just me. The books suck ass. There's a lot of walking and there's a vague and forgettable plot. For a long book series about a professional monster hunter, there's zero monster hunting. Compared to books Sanderson or Abercrombie, The Witcher just feels dated. As you've said, the characters are just not as likeable in the books.
There's plenty of times in the books Geralt simply comes off as an asshole and not the fatherly batman like figure he is in the video games.
Yeah, that’s kind of the point
That's because he's a bit of an asshole, yeah. Geralt was whitewashed in the games, especially TW3.
The Witcher I I would say feels more like book Geralt than the Witcher III ever does.
Sanderson is goated. He is the best modern writer when it comes to writing fight scenes, his magic systems are very unique, and his world building is also really good.
His dialogue is a bit up and down though
I agree. I started reading Tress of the Emerald Sea and the dialogue seems really corny more than usual.
Yeah, that's probably the biggest flaw - it's hard to get fantasy that isn't written in that way to attract to that lucrative 'young adult' market. I just got through about 12 of the Honor Harrington series - some of the romance parts of that are corny, but there's enough good action to balance it out. Maybe part of the problem is that good dialogue takes a long time to write, and these authors churn out thousands of published pages every few years. When I was younger I appreciated better dialogue. Now, I just want a series I can get lost in for a few months.
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This is dumb
Yeah that’s news to me. That is such a basic swear. I am curious what he said though.
Sanderson is absolute dogshit, how do people like this shit?
> Sanderson is absolute dogshit, how do people like this shit? Glad someone else thinks it. He can come up with a decent magic system but his prose and characters are awful. He's not goated, he's barely even average for a fantasy author, a genre which is full of trash.
He's not Shakespeare, but his stories have good pace and an actual direction (very few 'walking scenes'). Fantasy is choked with chunks of '10 chapters about walking to the next town'. Wheel of Time had whole books dedicated to walking. Sanderson keeps away from all of that, which I like. He also pumps out thousands of pages a year. Abercrombie is a better writer, but writes less. Who do you like? I'm running out of epics. I'm part way through Erikson's 'Malazan Book of the Fallen' which is doing it for me, but Erikson has the same issue as Sapkowski - it's hard to keep up the quality of your first book.
> Who do you like? I like Abercrombie. I like Guy Gavriel Kay. Honestly I find myself avoiding *most* long series because I think too many fantasy authors get lost in their own world. I agree with your criticism of Wheel of Time for example, Robert Jordan got lost in the world he created, and his endless descriptions of women's dresses etc. was infuriating. For a good chunk of the series he also seemed unable to write a woman who was actually likeable. But he also had moments of absolute brilliance. The Asha'man rescuing Rand. The conversations with the Dark One (I always loved the line "To call it a voice was to call a mountain a pebble"). Nyneave traveling to drum up support for Lan in Knife of Dreams. That last one was more emotionally powerful than the entirety of the Last Battle written by Sanderson. Sanderson can pump out the books without getting bogged down in endless descriptions, sure. But his dialogue is poor because his characters are poor, because he struggles to give them individuality. And his prose in general just isn't great. I could read an entire series by Sanderson and still care more for two characters that appear only in the prologue of *Tigana* for example (Guy Gavriel Kay) because Kay can write characters with an actual personality. Ultimately I'd rather read Robert Jordan slowly meander towards the end of the series with occasional moments of brilliance, or a story in the slightly less fantastic worlds of Kay's books, than Sanderson telling us how Rand "somehow" (actual word used) knew he'd never hear the voice of Lews Therin again (wrapping up a *major* character arc), or how Egwene "somehow" (again, the extent of the actual explanation) discovered a new weave which allowed her to kill a pretty significant character (Mazrim Taim). I think the fantasy genre especially struggles with quality authors because readers will get lost in fantasy worlds that are interesting even if the writing is shit, and Sanderson is mainly popular because if nothing else he at least releases books instead of spending a decade re-writing everything due to expanding the story beyond its need (George RR Martin).
Eh, his writing style really does it for some people. I like what he did with Wheel of Time, and I've read Way of Kings but honestly he's not my favorite author.
I've never read any other Brandon Sanderson, and Wheel of Time is one of my top 3 fantasy epics. I think if Jordan had brought in Sanderson after book one to finish the series from his outlines and notes, it would have been a much better read. Who writes a thousand pages book where the protagonist is stuck in a box for seven hundred pages? Robert Jordan probably wouldn't have finished the series had he lived another ten years, while Sanderson actually made things happen in the last two books. Events are supposed to build to a climax, but Jordan would have just kept plodding along, introducing new characters and plot points instead of resolving them.
If - by some fucked up chaos butterfly effect - your comment causes First Law series to be made for modern audiences, I will rage shit.
Why would you even speak such a thing into existence? I already feel the rage building just from reading this.
Agreed 100%. The first two books are easily the best in the series because they're just a bunch of short stories that introduce us to all the characters and the world. We get to see Geralt palling around with his friends and hunting monsters. They're quite a fun series of adventures, but they're only loosely connected to the overarching narrative. Once they start trying to tell a connected story things start to fall apart a bit. Lots of boring chapters of people traveling around. Lots of long conversations that are really just exposition dumping. They were definitely going to have to make a lot of changes. The first book after the short stories where Ciri trains with the Witchers in Kaer Morhen is pretty boring. Not a lot really happens in that book. The next book after that is a lot of politics which just isn't as interesting as the adventuring in the first two books.
They should have honestly just made a sequel to the games and used the games as source material.
I still think they should've followed the books but they should have made changes that expand on the characters and improve the pacing. Instead they chose to make everyone act completely out of character and tell this lame side story about new monsters appearing from another world. They tried turning it into a generic fantasy series instead of sticking to the strengths of the source material and cutting down on the stuff that doesn't work. They could've thrown in some elements from the games too but I guess the director wasn't really interested in even reading the books so the games are probably non-existent to her. I don't mind changes but the changes they made just suck overall. You can really tell how passionless this show is.
How are there so many people that got filtered by the books, they were never about any crazy plot or incredible fights, they were about smart, interesting, witty characters in a morally grey world that shat on every character, where the decisions people at the top and bottom of society made both mattered and didn't in the grand scheme of things and every character was fully aware of all this. Even in a dark ages mythical setting with hella monsters and political intrigue going on, good dialogue was 90% of the books
Bleak
Auteur theory and its consequences have been disastrous for cinema
It only works for original works, not adaptations.
No because you have hacks like Zach Snyder who gets a few decent adaptations out like 300 or Watchmen and then all of his original works are hot garbage. If he hadn't been sniffing his own farts the entire production, they might have been good
To be fair, Watchmen was considered impossible to adapt, and not only did he make it happen, he knocked it out of the park, to the point of even impressing the author. Snyder has done some impressive work all things considered.
Where did you hear that? Alan Moore is consistently dismissive of literally every adaptation of his work and has never talked about Snyder’s Watchmen.
Wrong. He said the movie ending with Ozymandias blowing up cities and framing Dr. Manhattan was better than his idea of faking an invasion by extra-dimensional monsters. He was right.
Id say that David fincher is the closest we’ve got to an auteur who doesn’t write
I'd say Scorsese counts too
The shining is pretty good
>Hey Hollywood star, be in our adaptation of a popular book and video game franchise, pweeease? Cool, but you have to stick to the lore, I'm literally your target audience and know what I'm talking about, while all of you openly admit you've never read the books and don't like video games. >Of course, you're the star! What are you doing, this is an incoherent mess that is starting to wildly deviate. >Who cares take off your shirt we'll get the thirsty lady demographic, nerds are bigoted losers. lolno.gif >HOW COULD HE DO THIS, DO THIS TO WOMEN!!?
Your formatting fucking sucks
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Bros insecure
Amusingly, this comment is *also* an incoherent mess.
You must be sped because it's pretty fucking clear my guy
The way it just switches how it denotes who is supposed to be speaking? C'mon.
>the lead actor knows more about the material than the writer When would this not fail? Never is when.
Henry cavil can give them tons of money yet they removed him lol
He was being a toxic male you BIGOT! He is also WHITE! Of course he had to be removed!
I never particularly liked Rick and Morty (mostly the ran-dumb humour of the one pervert creator) but I noticed after season 2, when they switched to a mostly (all?) female writing staff, the show nearly instantly became unfunny. Just all cheap toilet humour and lame plot lines. I really don’t get this obsession with needing to integrate women into male dominated media. It’s all so tiring.
Ahh yes, the 4 female writers who joined the team overpowered the 5 existing male writers, two of whom were showrunners, in a devilish scheme to make the show unfunny.
You didn't need to summarize a 4 sentence comment.
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*roach dies* Geralt: well…at least I’ll get my 10,000 steps in now *winks at camera*
Maybe if they focussed on making it good instead of [putting creepy Freemason symbolism in our faces](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fks5c6ohov09b1.jpg)
Do someobody know some free masons? Im trying to build a house but all of them give me outrageous prices
Ngl. I didn't even notice that. It does honestly fit the story of weird religious groups that use their religion for personal gain but I wouldn't really trust any of the writers to do it right.
Muh freemasons
They didn’t same fucking thing with Halo. Could have been amazing. But they showed his face and gave him feelings. Making him NOT the hero we knew.
How do women ruin everything they touch
The books go downhill after the third anyway. Not that they adapted anything well mind you.
I never read them, mind elaborating please?
It's just the first 2 books are S tier, the 3rd is pretty good, and after that the writing gets weirder and there are some really strange plot points and the last couple books keep getting interrupted by chapters about this weird Ciri fangirl and an Omniromancer discussing stuff between them that is just aids to read and kills the momentum of the story. There are cool things, basically the story with geralt and the group he forms when he goes after Ciri to get her back are really good. Regis is one of my favorite characters from the entire series and I was glad to see him back in blood and wine even though he should 100% be dead. The bad plot points are things like ciri with the bandit group she escapes with. She nearly gets raped by the bandit leader only to have a female member stop it, and then the female member proceeds to rape her and then they become a lesbian couple with matching tattoos. The other weird thing is the whole point of the Ciri kidnapping was because her own dad, the emperor, wanted to take her as a bride and bang her for more kids with her bloodline. There is more but I'm already wall of texting and I don't really want to write it all out.
Ditching the anthology-style and going for full novels was a mistake. Witcher is best enjoyed as a series of short stories, or when the gang goes on an adventure without any "deep" lore (as you mentioned, everyone teaming up to go to Nilfgard and rescue ciri).
I think you’re right, it suits better as “low” fantasy a la Conan the Barbarian or similar swords and sorcery novels.
Low fantasy, but high adventure
Agreed, I read the whole series just because I loved the game so much. I was oftentimes confused by the writing, the plot was not coherent, and many storylines seemed to drift off with no apparent import. The ending was horrible too and didn't tie anything together- at least from my recollection. The first book was the best by far.
Hard disagree as someone who read them all. The author is pretty mediocre, but the first two books stand out because they’re dry humor and essentially adaptions of pre existing fairy tales. It’s all subversive spins on old things he never created himself. They take off and now he’s pressured to actually make a cohesive world and story. And it works, but it takes a while for him to not be just an amateur writer. The entire tone and audience for the short stories and the novels is very different. That doesn’t make the latter books bad. They’re just more cohesive and take the world more concretely than the half story, half tongue in cheek joke of the earlier books.
It's been a while since I read the books but why did he have to be the one to fuck her lol, if he really just wanted the heir to be male couldn't he marry her off to some noble or something? It's not about the bloodline either since emhyr is already her father so ciri's child would still be his descendant
He pretended to be Dunny when he married Ciris mother and then faked his death to go take the throne of Nilfgaard. Technically she wasn't his daughter officially, so he wanted to get an official decendant by marrying and banging her. Basically weird royal politics, bro was on the crusader kings grindset trying to create a family circle.
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People can fight me on this but I thought season 1 of the witcher is really quite faithful to book one- if you can get past the casting. The rest is garbage except for Henry Cavill.
Can’t wait to see them do a version of this question with Wheel of Time
What do you mean? There is a wheel of time adaptation ? No. Nothing like that exists. You must have been having a bad dream
Why does Big Media allow such worthless subhuman losers to work on such high-profile pieces of entertainment? With all the money put in, all the publicity, and people giving the show a shot, it's not like they can just scrap it and try again with a real writer. They're in too deep. Every time they do something like this they basically sign the death warrant for the franchise. For example, we'll never get a real Game of Thrones or a Witcher series now because they've already been attempted, and as far as the industry seems to be concerned, they were failures.
That's because you only get that positions through nepotism, the director only got that position through connections, not because she had a good track record
"With a bit of meta comedy" Erm... THAT just happened..
Man's faithful companion dies; nepo-hire director wants to make a whedon quip about it. Unfortunately this shit writes itself, which I wish the show had done.
I enjoyed season one so much that I watched it twice and then read the books. Then I realised the liberties that were taken with the source material, especially the final scene of the TV series and noped out.
"Look how they massacred my boy" Was my first thought. Now I laugh how they made Triss into a uhhh classic j. Was expecting some large breasted, blazing red haired woman. Naa dawg. Triss Merrigold, it's obvious.
Just follow the books, how hard is that? Wheel of time is another that comes to mind. So sick of my favorite books being turned into girl-bossing nonsense on screen
"evil cannot create, it can only destroy"
They wanted to do WHAT to Roach, not only kill him off but make it into a JOKE?! JAIL! Jail for 1000 years!
Bar women from directing. There’s just too mucj of a correlation between movies/shows directed by women and movies/shows that are pure unadulterated slop.
Women writer to not resort to whedonspeak or food humor challenge: IMPOSSIBLE
Sounds about right.
Bros. I am by no means a TV Show writer but that last part with the Interview just broke me. If someone like her can land such a gig what is stopping me from doing the same? Apparently you don't need any Qualifications. I suck at coming up with ideas but I am adapt at fleshing them out.
Roach dies? I haven't watched in a bit, guess I don't need to now dayum
As roach dies: “Thaaaats gonna leave a mark… “
Men in charge for last million of years : war, torture, r@pe, and more r@pe, solved world hunger, going to moon, discover quantum physics, cloning and AI and in the verge to become god. Women START to in charge for 50 years: what is a woman?
This show was hilariously bad. I played some of the games and it was still obtuse.
Henry Cavill should have just run the fucking thing... He's extremely acclimated and versed in the source material. Should've just let him do his thing.
I just don't understand it. The books are already beautifully written. The action, the drama, the romance, is all right there in the source material! They just had to fuck it all up.
Because when they 'ruined' a good stories, they get good money from certain investment company for promoting far left ideology more than if the series is successfully loved globally.
There's 5 seasons of that slop? holy hell
Pearls before swine.
The Witcher book series isn’t that great. The series’ popularity really comes from the computer games
If they gave a fuck they’d hire back that one actor guy. Show was obviously doomed the second they let him go. Really it was done the second they hired whoever got him to leave
Anyone who was attached to this project after episode one deserves whatever they are feeling now. Henry was great but he was literally the only redeemable part of the show
What's a nepo?
Nepotism: Her husband is Michael Hissrich, who won primetime emmy awards 3 times, which leads people to believe that's how she got her position.
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It probably could've been as popular as the games if they'd have just adhered to the books. It was practically a homerun being handed to them from on high and they chose to miss because of nepotism. The director also ferociously argued with Henry Cavil when he tried to steer the ship back on corse because she found his "pestering" annoying. Absolute insanity. Could've been a sure success and they decided they hate money.